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1935 Buffalo "Liberty"

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United States
4 Posts
 Posted 07/12/2008  12:21 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add gjroark to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
I have a 1935 Buffalo on which the word "LIBERTY" has a regular size "L" but the "IBERTY" is missing the lower half. The coin is in pretty good shape and doesn't appear damaged. Anyone know if this is sn error and if so, what it's called?
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Becky's Avatar
United States
954 Posts
 Posted 07/12/2008  1:44 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Becky to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply


Could be a Grease Filled Die. or post mint damage. We would need pics to be sure.
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foundinrolls's Avatar
United States
3507 Posts
 Posted 07/12/2008  1:46 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add foundinrolls to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Hi,

Welcome!

Is there a way to post a picture?

We can't tell what you have without a picture. The description, unfortunately can fit too many scenarios.

It can be the effect of damage or it could be something that was a part of the minting process. Many times a person who might not be familiar with the minting process can look at a coin and think it is not damaged when it really is.

If you can post a picture that would be a great help.

Thanks,
Bill
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United States
4 Posts
 Posted 07/13/2008  10:11 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add gjroark to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Couldn't get a good photo. Attached is my best effort. Thanks for the quick

Image: 1935-Buffalo- buffalo.jpg
21.02 KBreply.
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foundinrolls's Avatar
United States
3507 Posts
 Posted 07/13/2008  10:24 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add foundinrolls to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Hi,
It's hard to tell anything from that image. Do you happen to have a flatbed scanner?
If so, you can scan the coin at a higher resolution then trim the image and post it here.

Being in that region of the coin, it is at a point away from the rim where it could easily be damage caused by a counting machine. We often see a circular pattern of damage on coins caused by the machines used to count and wrap coins.

Of course, it is easier to tell if we can get a better picture. There are certainly possibilities other than the counting machine damage theory but there is no way to tell yet.

Thanks,
Bill
New Member
United States
4 Posts
 Posted 07/14/2008  9:26 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add gjroark to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Appears that my scan did not post. Here it is againl

Image: 1935-Buffalo- buffaloscan2.jpg
65.83 KB
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Collector 57's Avatar
Canada
17 Posts
 Posted 07/15/2008  11:45 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Collector 57 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Thats a very interesting nickle. I can,t tell you what caused it, hopefully the experienced members will. I,m interested in what they will have to say. I haven,t seen anything like it. And the field looks so good.
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foundinrolls's Avatar
United States
3507 Posts
 Posted 07/15/2008  1:18 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add foundinrolls to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Hi,

I have a few thoughts. It is still a little tricky to be entirely sure form a picture but...

One is as mentioned earlier, counting machine damage that over time and some circulation wear became smooth. There is what could be the remnants of counting machine damage on the LIB in the form of circular marks through those letters.

Two is the possibility of having been struck by a filled die. That would be when details on the die are filled with grease and debris and that stops the details from being struck up on the coin. To me, it does not have the right look for that as the bottoms of what is left of the letters is too consistently straight across. I would think that to be very unusual as filled die errors go.

Three is, and I'm sure this will be debated and that's good:-)...In the picture of your coin that I posted, and please compare it with your picture.... I outlined
an area below the word LIBERTY and an area above the word LIBERTY. I think that it is possible that someone tried to remove a deposit of the green corrosion that you see elsewhere on the coin. I see some on the nose and I see it some above the word LIBERTY. I contend that it is reasonable to think that there may have been some on the surface of the coin in the field in front of the Indian's face.

I suspect an abrasive tool like a Dremel tool that got away from the person cleaning the coin. Here is why I think it is possible.

The rim above LIBERTY is slightly flatter and broader then the rim is elsewhere. That indicates the possibility of tooling or at the very least artificial wear.

The area that I outlined seems to have little or no evidence of the green that I suspect was cleaned and that portion of the coin seems to have if you look at it closely, many small gouges that seem to have been smoothed a little over time.

I marked three large scratches on the nose that I propose may have been caused by the tool used clean the coin.

Also, the BERTY letters are the ones mostly missing. If I were going to try to clean green crud from the surface with a tool, I would start at the easiest spot and that would be in the larger area between the Indian's nose and the lettering. As I realized that it wasnt working and that I just scraped away a bunch of the bottom of the letters, I would stop before I completely blew away the LI of LIBERTY.

Lastly, If I were to try to experiment with cleaning a coin abrasively, I would experiment on a coin that has very little numismatic value such as a 1935 nickel.

This is , of course a scenario that may or may not be the case, but I think it has some merit based upon what I see on the coin.

Let's talk about it.

Have Fun,
Bill

1935-Buffalo-
Edited by foundinrolls
07/15/2008 1:20 pm
New Member
United States
4 Posts
 Posted 07/15/2008  9:41 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add gjroark to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Bill:
Your theory is interesting; I wonder how they would get the line so straight. I would think that the "grease and dirt" theory might be more credible but I am certainly no expert. Thanks to all who responded.

jim
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foundinrolls's Avatar
United States
3507 Posts
 Posted 07/16/2008  02:39 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add foundinrolls to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Hi,

Yeah, that thought crossed my mind too. That's why I am posing my idea as conjecture and not something definite. Sometimes It's tough to come up with an exact answer when looking at a picture. There are some cases where you can't figure it out even when the coin is right in front of you. If it is a damage and I am not saying it is or isn't at this point, the numbers of ways a coin could be messed with is infinite.

The line could be straight if the edge of whatever abraded it had a straight edge. I'm thinking of those little conical shaped grinding wheels or a round grinding wheel as suspects.

Still, I fully admit that it's guesswork on this one.

Thanks,
Bill

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