1971 S Lincoln Memorial Cent Doubled Die Wdoubled Die Obverse / DDO -006

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Author	Replies: 15 / Views: 4,542
tropicalbats Pillar of the Community United States 6114 Posts	Posted 05/05/2019 12:33 am Probably few are familiar with this one so I'm posting it. This is the only listed business strike doubled die obverse for a 1971-S Lincoln Cent, and in my opinion it is arguable whether it is a doubled doe or not. The extra bit beside the 1 is obvious, but Mr. Wexler also notes some doubling above the 7 as well. However this is a slightly later die stage than the one on his site and I don't see much going on above the 7 on this coin (not that I see anything on the coin he has listed either). Maybe a little nubbin right over the top of the vertical bar of the 7 on this coin if I put the light just right. 1971-S Lincoln Memorial cent doubled die WDDO-006 Report this Post to the Staff

Daves Errors Pillar of the Community United States 1566 Posts	Posted 05/05/2019 01:14 am I have 4 just like it All BU. Nice find. Wexler's has a couple different Markers. I think you might be right. The one he is showing might be a later Die Stage adding different markers. I don't know. I kind of agree with you to a point. Mine have a little doubling in the 7. But if you get a close up pic of the ONE It dose NOT really look like a ONE at all. Edited by Daves Errors 05/05/2019 01:41 am Report this Post to the Staff
Errers and Varietys Bedrock of the Community United States 74299 Posts	Posted 05/05/2019 01:30 am Great find tropicalbats! Was it from the bag? Errers and Varietys. Report this Post to the Staff
tropicalbats Pillar of the Community United States 6114 Posts	Posted 05/05/2019 01:43 am Thanks for adding the pics! Yes this one is from the same bag as all the other things I've been finding. Just filed away a 1970 DDO-001 and DDO-004 as well. Too much to photograph everything. Edited by tropicalbats 05/05/2019 01:45 am Report this Post to the Staff
GrapeCollects Pillar of the Community United States 8938 Posts	Posted 05/05/2019 01:52 am Good problem to have Report this Post to the Staff
tropicalbats Pillar of the Community United States 6114 Posts	Posted 05/05/2019 09:36 am Had a bit of a chance to ponder that extra 1. The more I look at Dave's pic the more I am thinking that it is actually a really nice class 8 DDO. Not totally convinced, but getting there. Hey Dave, I'm less thinking about a possible notch at the tip of the 7 but more like something above the vertical bar of the 7. Yours is a very early die example and wondering if you could take a similar close up of that area and see what shows up? Should be at least something raised there and would like to see what it looks like on your coin. Report this Post to the Staff
Daves Errors Pillar of the Community United States 1566 Posts	Posted 05/05/2019 1:34 pm Tropicalbats: A couple more pic's. I looked at the other ones I have, All came from the same BU roll I had gotten in 2007 Look the same. Kind of looks more like a Die Chip on the bar of the 7 IDK. Edited by Daves Errors 05/05/2019 1:35 pm Report this Post to the Staff
tropicalbats Pillar of the Community United States 6114 Posts	Posted 05/05/2019 1:48 pm True, it does look a bit like a die chip, but the fact that there is something there lends evidence to the DDO. I am leaning toward a yes on this being a DDO. Report this Post to the Staff
Daves Errors Pillar of the Community United States 1566 Posts	Posted 05/05/2019 2:04 pm I am not the one to Question Mr.Wexler the ERROR MASTER lol. It is what it is until prover otherwise. Edited by Daves Errors 05/05/2019 2:05 pm Report this Post to the Staff
Jim0815 Pillar of the Community United States 5239 Posts	Posted 05/05/2019 2:26 pm Like always, just shaking my head with a smile. Great find! Report this Post to the Staff
tropicalbats Pillar of the Community United States 6114 Posts	Posted 05/05/2019 2:37 pm Good science always requires questioning things. Quite a few doubled dies and RPMs have been debunked over the years, so when something is looking a bit fishy it's worth having a discussion about it. But yes, it goes in the book as a DDO until proven otherwise! Report this Post to the Staff
Tanman2001 Pillar of the Community United States 4404 Posts	Posted 05/05/2019 4:03 pm There are actually a few highly unusual DDOs on 1971 cents from all three mints. The reason why many don't know of any besides this one (1971-S WDDO-006) is that they are only listed in the Crawford Die Variety files. Billy G. Crawford passed away in 2016, and his website is no longer up. The only thing left of his files are the "A Detailed Analysis of Lincoln Cent Varieties" CDs that he sold around 2010. I'm fortunate to have purchased one off ebay for $50 a year or two ago, I haven't seen another copy since. I made a post a while ago asking about this CD before I found my copy, someone else on this forum has a copy as well if I remember correctly. Here's the interesting 1971's from the CD. the 1971-D is incredibly similar to 1971-S, just on the other side of the 1. (Also note the 1971-S DDO listing has arrows pointing to what the doubling to the seven is believed to be, I don't think it is visible on the two examples posted in this thread.) From 1969 to 1972, the Mint removed lugs from the working hubs, which resulted in many of the strongest doubled dies that we know of (1969-S DDO, 1970-S DDO, 1971 DDO, all of the 1972 DDOs). Quote: In 1969 the Mint modified the obverse design for the Lincoln Cent. As a result of those changes, they experienced difficulty in getting satisfactory impressions in the working dies. To remedy the problem they removed the lugs from the hubs and dies to allow for deeper penetration of the hub into the die. This did fix the problem and allowed the deeper penetration of the hub into the die, but it opened up the possibility of doubled dies again being created with strong spreads. It didn't take long for the consequences of this decision to be felt. In 1969 a major doubled die was produced for the 1969-S Lincoln cents. Another major doubled die was produced for the 1970-S Lincoln cents. Several doubled dies found their way into production for the 1971 Lincoln cents with two major varieties known for the 1971-S proof cents. The dam broke in 1972 and several doubled die varieties were produced for the Lincoln cents from all three Mints including a major doubled die for the obverse of the P-Mint cents. During this period of time significant doubled dies were being produced for other denominations as well. After the flood of doubled die varieties in 1972 and all of the publicity that they generated, the Mint returned to the practice of placing the lugs around the hubs and dies. -John A. Wexler, doubleddie.com Is it possible that it also allowed all of these unusual DDOs to occur? I think so. Just look at how many doubled dies there are with slight doubling on the date from 1969-1972 compared to the very few Class VIII doubled dies that have been found after 1973. The 1971-S WDDO-006 is just an extreme example of this. I believe WDDO-006 is a doubled die, I agree with the listing. Report this Post to the Staff
tropicalbats Pillar of the Community United States 6114 Posts	Posted 05/05/2019 4:26 pm Thanks Tanman, That's a very helpful bit. I was unaware of those varieties in the Crawford files, and your overall analysis seems very sound. Nicely put together. I might think about sending it off to Dr. Wiles to see about a CONECA listing for this one. Plenty strong enough and seems worthy. Report this Post to the Staff
Daves Errors Pillar of the Community United States 1566 Posts	Posted 05/05/2019 4:51 pm I have a 1973 S with a similar mark on the chin but its much smaller. This is kind why I was thinking the one on the 1971 S might not be a one! Report this Post to the Staff
Tanman2001 Pillar of the Community United States 4404 Posts	Posted 05/05/2019 4:56 pm I don't think that is comparable, completely different year, location, size. This 1973 is a gouge or just damage. Definitely interested to see what Wiles will say about the 1971-S. Edited by Tanman2001 05/05/2019 4:58 pm Report this Post to the Staff
Greasy Fingers Pillar of the Community United States 7038 Posts	Posted 05/05/2019 10:53 pm Excellent posts people, bookmarked so I can hand enter notes into my cheatsheet binder..Guess I'll have to dig out my 1970 rolls and recheck..Thanks again great info. Report this Post to the Staff
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1971 S Lincoln Memorial Cent Doubled Die WDDO-006