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 Replies: 9 / Views: 2,116 |
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Valued Member
United States
216 Posts |
I was wondering what the chances are of obtaining a cleaned, dipped, colored, or otherwise altered coin are if I bought an older (pre-modern, e.g., Indianhead cent, Buffalo nickel, Standing Liberty quarter, Walking Liberty half, Morgan/Peace Dollar, etc.) "raw" coin from a dealer. My thoughts are that coin dealers should be knowledgeable enough to know if a coin has been altered and would come back as a "detail" coin from a Third Party Grader ( TPG). Would it be safe to assume that the reason why a dealer is selling a "raw" coin is because s/he knows that it would come back ungradable from a TPG? |
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Pillar of the Community
5464 Posts |
Ultimately, you have to educate yourself to know what you're looking at. Buyer beware. Quote:Would it be safe to assume that the reason why a dealer is selling a "raw" coin is because s/he knows that it would come back ungradable from a TPG? No, it would not be safe to assume that. |
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Rest in Peace
United States
18456 Posts |
I would never buy a coin from an online dealer sight unseen . Especially if you never dealt with them before . Most dealers are up and up and will not send you junk if he stated a specific grade to the coin . But still , you really should look at photos of the coins you want to buy . And never be satisfied with just one side of the coin . It's rare but when I see that , it raises a red flag , and I stay clear of it .  |
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Valued Member
United States
442 Posts |
Quote:
I would never buy a coin from an online dealer sight unseen . Especially if you never dealt with them before . Most dealers are up and up and will not send you junk if he stated a specific grade to the coin . But still , you really should look at photos of the coins you want to buy . And never be satisfied with just one side of the coin . It's rare but when I see that , it raises a red flag , and I stay clear of it . I think they were asking about local dealers. I have local dealers I trust, but not all. I don't think you can assume just because they sell raw coins that they are trying to pass off "details" coins. More likely it's because the coins might not be valuable enough to justify the time/cost of grading. But I think it's possible for a dealer to sell a coin they honestly see as problem free, and still have it come back "details". Heck, even among the TPGs I've heard stories of one company giving a "details". Then someone cracking it, sending it to another TPG, and having it come back straight grade. Most of the time the damage, cleaning, scratch is obvious to most. But not always. Say a tiny scratch or rim ding might not details a coin. But a large one would. Well at what point does tiny become big enough to matter. It can be subjective. |
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
17884 Posts |
Quote:Would it be safe to assume that the reason why a dealer is selling a "raw" coin is because s/he knows that it would come back ungradable from a TPG? Not necessarily. It could also be the case that it doesn't make economic sense to submit it Lets say he has a coin that lists for $125 that he has $80 in and which he could sell right away raw for $110. It will cost him at least $25 to get it slabbed and it may take a month to get it back. Now he has $105 in it and he can get $125, so after a months wait he makes $20. But if he had sold it raw he could have sold it right away for $110 and made $30. In a case like that slabbing it slows his turnover rate and results in LESS money in his pocket. A coin like that it makes more sense to sell raw. |
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Valued Member
 United States
216 Posts |
Conder101 - Thank you for your response. I was looking for a beautiful 1921 high relief Peace dollar. I looked on the APMEX site, and noticed that several buyers commented that their purchase, after sending it to a Third Party Grader ( TPG), revealed that their purchase was either AU, cleaned, or dipped. For such a valuable coin, I wonder why a retailer would sell one raw. My only thought is that they know it would not be gradable if sent to a TPG, therefore, they are selling it ungraded. Edited by Hidalgo
07/21/2020 2:50 pm
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1316 Posts |
Now that you mention APMEX, it brings a lot more context. I inquired about a coin that appeared to be incorrectly labeled as to its denomination and their customer service rep said that they are volume dealer and didn't have time to research if the labeled denomination was correct. I think they are a bullion dealer first and a rare coin dealer second, and as such details like a cleaning are of less concern to them than a rare coin dealer. A 1921 Silver dollar is a 1921 silver dollar... |
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Valued Member
United States
216 Posts |
A few years ago, I purchased several classic raw coins (e.g., Barber dimes, classic commemoratives, etc.), advertised as BU/uncirculated, on ebay and sent them to NGC for grading. I also purchased a Walking Liberty coin advertised as BU by Great Southern Coins. About 60% of the coins that I bought from ebay were graded as "detailed" - cleaned, colored, etc. The coin I bought from Great Southern Coins came back from NGC as having a spot removed. These experiences left me suspicious of dealers who sell classic raw coins advertised as BU/uncirculated or raw coins of high value. |
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Rest in Peace
United States
18456 Posts |
I see your point but I'm not a fan of Great Southern Coins . And I know a lot of other guys aren't either . They have mastered a way to make inferior coins look decent through their photographic skills . With time and experience you'll learn who to stay away from .  |
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Valued Member
United States
442 Posts |
APMEX would not be a source I trust for anything other than modern bullion. Looks like they use stock photos. Not necessarily the coin you will receive. If I don't see photos of the actual coin they will send me, forget it. Plenty of '21s on ebay for that price or less.
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Replies: 9 / Views: 2,116 |
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Posted 07/21/2020 11:17 am
