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 Replies: 8 / Views: 2,509 |
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Bedrock of the Community
United Kingdom
17890 Posts |
Over the weekend a friend of mine asked me to look through a bag of miscellaneous coins he had. Most of them were the usual mix of pre-decimal British junk and pre-Euro coins brought back from holidays in France and Spain. However, this item caught my eye. It's definintely a coin weight, but can anyone tell me any more about it? And does it have any value? (My friend is planning to sell his coin accumulation - apart from the miscellaneous junk, he has quite a lot of pre-1947 silver coins pulled from circulation in the 1960s and 1970s).  |
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Pillar of the Community
 Sweden
2124 Posts |
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Bedrock of the Community
 United Kingdom
17890 Posts |
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Moderator
 United States
34393 Posts |
This is pretty cool. To help me learn, could you guys help to decipher the inscriptions? I'm sure that must be George III, but what about the S? D and 10:5? And on the other side, I'm not sure what that stuff is other than a date. Thx for any light you can shed on this piece.
"If you climb a good tree, you get a push."
-----Ghanaian proverb
"The danger we all now face is distinguishing between what is authentic and what is performed."
-----King Adz
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Pillar of the Community
United States
561 Posts |
The S and D are for Shillings and Pence (the British standard is a D for Pence), thus 10 shillings:5 pence (10:5).
This is nearly a half guinea, as a full guinea is 21 shillings, so 10 S:6 D for a half guinea. Not sure why the difference is there. The source above suggests your weight is ~0.1g short of a half guinea, that may explain the 1 penny short, and numista suggests a half guinea is 64.7 grains, which is also just over this weight, so that could also explain it not being a full half guinea.
The other side has Dwt and Gr, Dwt is pennyweight (a gold measurement) and Gr is grains. 2 pennyweight (24 grains to a pennyweight) and 16 grains, so 2 Dwt:16 Gr which gives a total mass of 64 grains.
So your weight is telling you both what it weighs (2 Dwt:16 Gr), and what that is equal to in shillings and pence (10 S:5 D)
Edited by PNWType
03/08/2022 03:13 am
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Pillar of the Community
Sweden
2124 Posts |
Yes, Geo.III is George III. Then on the same side we have s d / 10:5, which should be read 10 s 5 d, that is, 10 shillings and 5 pence. The inscription on the other side reads 2 dwt 16 gr, that is, 2 pennyweights 16 grains (0.133 troy ounce or 4.15 grams). And then the year 1772. But, a guinea had a value of 21 shillings and should weigh 5 dwt 9 gr, so shouldn't this ½ guinea coin weight show a value of 10 s 6 d and weigh 2 dwt 16½ gr? Well, a guinea was a coin whose value was determined by its gold content (or, in practice, its weight). While the nominal value was indeed 10 s 6 d, wear and tear on the sometimes 100 years old guineas still in circulation towards the end of the 18th century, meant that the actual value could be less, depending on the weight. So this is a coin weight for guineas weighing a little less than nominal, and consequently valued at a little less than nominal. In 1774, a proclamation standardized the guinea values into four tiers, which for ½ guineas yields (somewhat simplified): 2 dwt 16½ gr - 10 s 6 d 2 dwt 16 gr - 10 s 5 d 2 dwt 14 gr - 10 s 3 d 2 dwt 13 gr - 10 s 0 d The tiers were also tied to year of minting, so the highest tier was for "new" coins, the second highest for coins minted from 1772 and on, the third for 1760-72 and the fourth for older coins (this was perhaps not fully thought out ...!  ). So the year 1772 on the weight is not the year the weight was made, it refers to its usage for coins minted from 1772 and on. (On other coin weights one can can see inscriptions like "Coined since 1772" or "Coined before 1772.") |
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Bedrock of the Community
United Kingdom
17890 Posts |
Thanks, erafjel - that is really interesting! The 10:5 was puzzling me!  |
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Moderator
United States
34393 Posts |
Ok yes exactly. Thanks to both @pnw and @era for helping decipher the inscriptions. Definitely helps put this in context.
"If you climb a good tree, you get a push."
-----Ghanaian proverb
"The danger we all now face is distinguishing between what is authentic and what is performed."
-----King Adz
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Moderator
Australia
16806 Posts |
I suspect that the odd denomination - almost, but not quite, a half-guinea - was intended not for an old worn-out half-guinea, but for a foreign coin.
I haven't been able to find a good match for a non-British gold coin from the 1700s that weighs about 4.13 grams. The Portuguese/Brazilian johanna (2000 reis) is close, at 4.03 grams (2 dwt 14 gr), but I think that weight is wrong enough to disqualify it.
Don't say "infinitely" when you mean "very"; otherwise, you'll have no word left when you want to talk about something really infinite. - C. S. Lewis
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Replies: 8 / Views: 2,509 |
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Posted 03/07/2022 1:34 pm
