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The Elongated Third Ray 2007 P Goerge Washington Dollar

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CCFPress's Avatar
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 Posted 09/15/2023  2:23 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add CCFPress to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
PCGS - Originally, I had zero interest in the small dollar coins. That was until the nationwide coin shortage occurred and my search for the West Point-minted "W" Washington quarters had proven unproductive. A friend suggested that I start searching through the Presidential $1 coins.

The-Elongated-Third-Ray-2007-P-Goerge-Washington-Dollar

One variety that caught my eye and intrigued me the most was the speculation and possible existence of an "Elongated Third Ray" of the tiara on the 2007-P George Washington issue. This coin was believed to have been found in 2007, which was the first year of issue for the Presidential $1 coin series. I searched for information on this coin for months online and elsewhere for any documentation of a confirmed or attributed example, but nothing was found.

All the information I acquired over these months was merely speculation of its existence. Was it an unintentional die gouge which extended the ray? Was it a scratch? Was the die intentionally modified, altered, or manipulated at the mint? No one seemed to have the answer. There was no evidence that this coin had ever been officially recognized or attributed by any grading service or in CherryPickers' Guide to Rare Die Varieties of United States coins, by Bill Fivaz and J.T. Stanton.

So, my search began. I found that banks had boxes of these small dollars that none of their customers wanted. After months and months of searching through thousands of these Presidential dollars, I found what I believe are several examples of this variety. The design of the ray seemed too well formed to be a die gouge. I realized that, after having been in circulation for 15 years, this variety was still unreported and still could be cherry picked.

I contacted a number of key players in the variety/error coin community, showed them the coin, and even submitted a notarized Freedom of Information Act request to the U.S. Treasury and U.S. Mint for any and all documentation, records, or logs relating to the minting process of this specific coin. The request generated zero results.

My non-professional numismatic eyes suggested that the ray was too clear to be anything other than an intentional die alteration or modification at the mint and my aim has been to have it assigned a FS (Fivaz-Stanton) number. With the help, opinions, and feedback from many experts in the field - too many to mention - this interesting observation would not have been possible. The tenacity, commitment, and due diligence in this effort eventually found its way to recognition by PCGS, which attributes the Elongated Third Ray variety.
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Dearborn's Avatar
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SamCoin's Avatar
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 Posted 09/15/2023  9:47 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add SamCoin to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Interesting read - not sure if this was posted by the author, but if it was, were you able to determine if the elongated rays all came from a single die or if there were multiple dies with this design variety?
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Errers and Varietys's Avatar
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 Posted 09/15/2023  10:52 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Errers and Varietys to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I have heard about this one. Very interesting for sure. Thank you for sharing it.
Errers and Varietys.
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Petespockets55's Avatar
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 Posted 09/16/2023  04:18 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Petespockets55 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
This is an intriguing variety.
From the examples you have found, have you been able to determine whether only one die is affected?

I wonder if the source of trail dies could be a possibility on how it was created. Will Brooks did an in-depth study of trail dies with others and they determined it was die polishing (the direction of the polishing makes a difference).

Do you see any design weakness to Lady Liberty's arm where the ray crosses it?
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 Posted 06/16/2025  8:30 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Marc Ingram to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
@CCFPress - You're the press guy here. I've been looking. Am I missing it? Shouldn't this coin be in the CherryPickers Guide? What is your opinion?
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-makecents-'s Avatar
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 Posted 06/16/2025  10:08 pm  Show Profile   Check -makecents-'s eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add -makecents- to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
@CCFPress - You're the press guy here. I've been looking. Am I missing it? Shouldn't this coin be in the CherryPickers Guide? What is your opinion?
It does have an FS# and a decent worth.


The-Elongated-Third-Ray-2007-P-Goerge-Washington-Dollar
-makecents-
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 Posted 06/16/2025  10:52 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Marc Ingram to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
It does have an FS# and a decent worth.


[Click to see a Larger Image!]



Yes, I saw that on another thread. Wow!!
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 Posted 06/16/2025  11:02 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add gigi2110 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I have heard about this before, not sure if was from Shaun on YouTube or elsewhere.
gigi2110
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 Posted 06/17/2025  08:27 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Marc Ingram to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
I have heard about this before, not sure if was from Shaun on YouTube or elsewhere.


Yes, same here. Seems like there would or should be more talk about it.
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 Posted 06/19/2025  07:50 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Marc Ingram to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
@CCFPress

Do you have videos here by Edward Van Orden, PCGS Variety Expert?
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jbuck's Avatar
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 Posted 06/19/2025  09:20 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add jbuck to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
CCFPress is an automated robot account. You are not going to get a response.

Content of this post came from a PCGS news feed.
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 Posted 06/19/2025  09:48 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Marc Ingram to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
CCFPress is an automated robot account. You are not going to get a response.

Content of this post came from a PCGS news feed.


Oh, shoot!!! So there's no one on the other end of CCFPress?

Okay, good tip. Thank you! Now I'm wondering how I can contact Mr. Edward Van Orden.
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 Posted 06/19/2025  11:03 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add bobby131313 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
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 Posted 06/19/2025  11:17 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add jbuck to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

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So there's no one on the other end of CCFPress?
Nope. At least, not until SkyNet takes over.
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 Posted 06/19/2025  3:23 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Marc Ingram to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Thank you @bobby131313 @jbuck !

You guys have been here awhile. Any thoughts on how I might track this guy down?

I've been on PCGS's website and contacted customer service with no feedback yet.
Edited by Marc Ingram
06/19/2025 3:32 pm
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