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Replies: 22 / Views: 1,435 |
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Pillar of the Community
 United States
6506 Posts |
I have been cooped up in the house lately, so one of my amusements has been checking ebay listings for varieties. Everyone once in a while I spot a minor doubled die on a BU coin. Not full scale FS cherries, but more like Variety Vista or Wexler style listings. It being ebay, many of the coins are considerably overpriced for a nice example of a common coin. That does beg the question, though: what is the actual premium (if any) for a minor doubled die?
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
94367 Posts |
I'd like to hear @tropicalbats' reply to this question.
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Moderator
 United States
96214 Posts |
That is a very good question that I'll be watching what the answer would be. 
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Pillar of the Community
United States
4404 Posts |
For any of the extremely minor doubled dies in nice BU (I'm thinking the ultra modern stuff, slight extra thickness, bars on columns, that kinda stuff) I'd say worth $1 or so, maybe $2-$3 for quarters just because it's a higher denomination. Circulated and imperfect UNCs will be worth little if anything just because of low interest and high availability. That being said, if you scroll through ebay sold listings you can find examples of Machine Doubling sell for $5, $10, even $20, so who honestly knows.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
6108 Posts |
Well, it's complicated but I can try to boil it down. This relates to non FS varieties, as they are totally different. So, in a broad brush, a BU Lincoln Cent worth up to maybe twenty bucks can add around 50% to the value as long as it's not a totally trivial variety. A solid DDR for example well photographed so the buyer can see it would likely add that 50% to the coin value. But after that roughly $20 barrier the value of a variety on the coin quickly goes down, first to zero, and then to negative numbers. Top grade collectors generally want nothing strange on their coins, and will stay away from coins with varieties so you end up with the best buyers removing themselves from the sale/auction. At a finer detail, things change slightly. This requires knowing the general rarity of things and popularity of varieties, but certain non FS varieties can do very well. These will get picked up by folks like myself who collect varieties and know when something is rare and top grade even though considered a minor. About 50% of the time when I sell something like this on ebay, I actually know the buyer, as it's not that big of a community. As an example, on Wednesday night I sold a Lincoln Cent 1955-D/D/D FS-503 RAW at least MS64 and probably 65. It went for $11.50. Worth lots more than that, but not a popular variety and not registry grade so it just doesn't go high. On the other hand I sold a 1942 Lincoln Cent RAW that looked like solid 65 with little hope of reaching 66 with a DDR-005 for $48. One of those coins is unpopular and there are quite a few better examples out there, but it's a major. The other is a minor probably most folks on this board would have to look up to know what it looks like, but it's super rare in any MS grade let alone one in the 65 range. So the folks who know the coins know where to put their money, and which one would make a great addition to any collection. So in general, if you are going to pick a nice BU coin with a minor variety on it, you have to pay what the coin is worth not some inflated Buy it Now price, and then any end profit is low and if you resell on ebay they get most of it with fees plus then there's shipping costs. Buy them to collect them, not to resell them. Great way to add quality coins to a variety collection. But with enough experience you learn which ones are the rare and popular ones, and can come out a bit ahead by being selective in which ones you go after.
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Pillar of the Community
  United States
6506 Posts |
I appreciate the lengthy answer, Mr. Bats. =) Your answer makes sense to me. If I were to paraphrase my understanding, this is how I'd do it. For non-FS varieties, the value is established primarily on the value of the graded coin. Below $20 base value, you can reach up to a 50% premium for an attractive DDO or DDR variety. As with any guideline there are exceptions, particularly for rare or popular varieties. Above the $20, the interested parties tend to be focused on grade, and those folks don't really want varieties, and some may actively avoid them. That basically answers my question. As I am browsing, if I find an interesting variety that I want for my collection, now I have a guideline on what to pay. Buying with the intention of reselling seems to be a pro game—the collector community is small, the premiums are modest, and shipping will consume a lot of profit. Tanner, I appreciate your answer as well. I had wondered at the ultra-modern stuff, as I find that the most often. I saw a number of nickels listed on BVC in the $5-10 range, but they don't seem to have sold (yet). I keep finding 2023-P nickels with the odd ghosted letters on the letters on Monticello, but I have been completely unable to make progress matching them to the large catalog of new listings. You don't see the ultra-modern DDRs inadvertently listed very often, though. Newer BU nickels tend to be sold on multi-listings with stock photos. Even on individual listings, the picture quality is usually so poor that you would never be able to see lines in doorways. There's not really an opportunity to pick cherries.
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
94367 Posts |
Interesting for sure, Sounds like circuated exmples of the more common DD's don't carry much of a premium.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
6108 Posts |
Frog it depends on your definition of "much of a premium." A circulated 1955-D coin is worth like Three Cents. But with a nice RPM it could maybe get $2.50. That's a huge premium as far as a percentage goes, but a very low premium in real dollars. Finding varieties in circulated wheat bags is fun and adds to a collection, but by no means a way to make money. I tend to sell off my doubles and whatnot in bulk at like 50 coins per lot as there is no way to sell them individually.
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
19159 Posts |
Good conversation. There are soooooo many variables in play--from the 'technical' aspects of numismatics, to the volatility of the marketplace (where human behavior has a field day).
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
74233 Posts |
Most of the time, usually a couple dollars at most.
Errers and Varietys.
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Pillar of the Community
 United States
4038 Posts |
I personally place very little value on circulated examples of varieties, even FS types. It is usually more difficult to attribute varieties on coins that have seen hits and wear from circulation. Minor varieties can be completely obliterated that way. Even BU coins can see hits that cause difficulty in attribution, but other critical markers such as die cracks and breaks are more easily seen on BU coins.
Contact me for photographic equipment or visit my home page at: http://macrocoins.com
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Moderator
 United States
56855 Posts |
Brandmeister, Thank for starting this thread,it was a very good read. John1 
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Moderator
 United States
15435 Posts |
Good read - appreciate the sharing of knowledge. 
Take a look at my other hobby ... http://www.jk-dk.art
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Pillar of the Community
 United States
8751 Posts |
 Thanks for starting this thread and nice input from the pros. A prime example of what tripicalbats was saying about selling off as rolls. I have the only "listed" Lincoln Cent doubled die for 2023 and was selling one every now and then for $5 and as much as $9 but moving very few. I listed for $50 a roll and sold one at full price and another $40. It's hard to sell a minor variety and make it worthwhile. That's why I have many that just sit in boxes. Good info though and would think this will help the OP and others when buying.
-makecents-
Edited by -makecents- 11/18/2023 07:11 am
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Moderator
 United States
96214 Posts |
Well, I learned a little here, so, thanks again.
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Pillar of the Community
  United States
6506 Posts |
Makecents, that's an interesting anecdote. I assume the 2023 cent is the Tootsie roll designer initials DDR on CopperCoins? I couldn't find any 2023 listings on Wexler or Variety Vista. I would say that a 100x markup per coin is pretty epic. So what's the rationale for someone buying a whole roll? Is that a dealer, planning to sell them individually?
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Replies: 22 / Views: 1,435 |