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Interesting English Tokens...any Info?

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WpgLwr's Avatar
Canada
1082 Posts
 Posted 05/04/2009  9:10 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add WpgLwr to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
Any token experts in the house?

Found the following three today; all appear to be copper or bronze:

(1) About the same size as the current British penny. Around the top edge the wording ARNOTT CANNOCK & Co.; around the bottom edge GLASGOW, and in the centre DRAPERS / JAMAICA / STREET. The same edge legend is on the back, and in the centre a bun-headed portrait of Queen Victoria, facing left. Strangely, no date!

(2) About the same size as the pre-decimal halfpenny. Starting at 6:00 it says PAYABLE BY I.K. PICARD LEADWORKS HULL and in the centre, HULL / HALF / PENNY / 1812. On the back, a sitting lion with a shield by his right paw with a single fleur-de-lys. Around the edge, it says ESSE QUAM VIDERI. British or Canadian?

(3) Similar size to number (2). In the middle, a circle with HALF / PENNY / TOKEN within, and around the outside the legend starting at not quite 7:00 and going around to not quite 5:00 says PAYABLE AT BRISTOL AND LONDON, and at 6:00 the date 1811. On the other side, within a circle a ship under full sail, beneath which it says BRISTOL, and then around the rest of the coin, PATENT SHEATHING NAIL MANUFACTORY.

Any of these worth keeping?
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Peter THOMAS's Avatar
Australia
2830 Posts
 Posted 05/04/2009  10:33 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Peter THOMAS to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
G'day, they sound interesting.
The Victorian one presumably arises from the era 1837~1901. That's not an era that I've looked closely at, and I don't recall seeing one from Glasgow.

The other two come from one of the eras when tokens were manufactured in large numbers, and in many designs, to supplement the shortfall in "official" coinage.
"The Great Recoinage" began in 1816, and tokens ceased to circulate soon after.
Both of yours often come up on the'bay. Even in a lower grade, they fetch at least $5.

I try to pick up any associated with the towns where my ancestors lived in that time. I don't know if other genealogists are crowding "our" field, ...

Peter in Oz
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Sap's Avatar
Australia
16817 Posts
 Posted 05/05/2009  06:57 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Sap to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
(1) About the same size as the current British penny. Around the top edge the wording ARNOTT CANNOCK & Co.; around the bottom edge GLASGOW, and in the centre DRAPERS / JAMAICA / STREET. The same edge legend is on the back, and in the centre a bun-headed portrait of Queen Victoria, facing left. Strangely, no date!

Not so strange; as Peter said, "tokens" were illegal in Britain during the reign of Queen Victoria. This is actually an "advertising medal", theoretically not intended to be used in circulation as money (though if people went and spent them, well, that could hardly be the shopkeeper's fault, now, could it? )

According to Google Maps, Jamaica Street is in downtown Glasgow, right next to the railway station. I haven't found any reference or identical example of this token doing a quick google search, but I did find a similar piece on ebay, from the same store, only in Newcastle. They probably date from the 1850's, about the time of the token craze here in the Australian colonies; these advertising pieces and the tokens bound for overseas colonies were often made in the same places.

Quote:
(2) About the same size as the pre-decimal halfpenny. Starting at 6:00 it says PAYABLE BY I.K. PICARD LEADWORKS HULL and in the centre, HULL / HALF / PENNY / 1812. On the back, a sitting lion with a shield by his right paw with a single fleur-de-lys. Around the edge, it says ESSE QUAM VIDERI. British or Canadian?

British; Hull is a port-city in Yorkshire. My little British token book gives four varieties of the "lion seated" Hull halfpenny, listed in Davis as Yorkshire numbers 95 to 98.

Quote:
3) Similar size to number (2). In the middle, a circle with HALF / PENNY / TOKEN within, and around the outside the legend starting at not quite 7:00 and going around to not quite 5:00 says PAYABLE AT BRISTOL AND LONDON, and at 6:00 the date 1811. On the other side, within a circle a ship under full sail, beneath which it says BRISTOL, and then around the rest of the coin, PATENT SHEATHING NAIL MANUFACTORY.

This one's listed in the token book as having four die varieties, Davis Somerset numbers 88 to 91. My catalogue's values date from 1970, so there's no point quoting them to you - except to say that the values for this one are higher than for token #2, so presumably this one is scarcer and/or more in demand.
Don't say "infinitely" when you mean "very"; otherwise, you'll have no word left when you want to talk about something really infinite. - C. S. Lewis
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WpgLwr's Avatar
Canada
1082 Posts
 Posted 05/05/2009  08:45 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add WpgLwr to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Wow...thanks Sap, for the lenghty and educational answer. Kind of makes me appreciate them more.
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