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Any Chance This Is What It Says It Is?

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WpgLwr's Avatar
Canada
1082 Posts
 Posted 11/19/2009  11:14 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add WpgLwr to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Yes, that would make a lot of sense, since they have a certification number on each coin. One should be able to look up and confirm the certification. It would make it much easier for bidders of such coins sold online, and would probably make the seller's life easier as well.
Valued Member
Canada
166 Posts
 Posted 11/19/2009  11:40 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add steve kuznicki to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
My best guess is that (provided it has not been tampered with) that it was mislabeled at ICCS. I don't handle very many coins, but I have had mislabeled coins from ANACS (a 1900-H Cant listed as a 1900) NGC (again a 1900-H cent listed as a 1900) and PCGS (a 1966 PL dollar I got for $15 listed as MS66, don't I wish). so such things happen regularly. The only coin I ever had personally submitted to PCGS was an 1882-S US 2 1/2 dollar gold piece that came back 1882-P.
Pillar of the Community
Canada
1248 Posts
 Posted 11/19/2009  12:21 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add hhbkiddo to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
hello all,

please note there are coins out there,which have NOT yet been discovered as being Other than the original issues.
personally I have about half a dozen right here. I also know of several "one of a kind" coins which in fact are available to buy.

AND, they are not necessarily mislabeled. Just discovered, marked as what they are, and labeled accordingly. hence, we might have seen it before, BUT as we did not know, did not recognize it before!

there could be many factors why the coin has certain properties which were NOT known UNTIL it was discovered.
I submitted coins , 2 different coins, same year, same type, same everything, to Bill Cross (Charlton Boss)at his request for examination and to verify the differences / variety.
they came both back----NO comment!! makes one wonder...A blind person can see that these 2 coins are different!

So, why the fuss about a Die break in a PL dollar?
because you have never seen it before....!
Pillar of the Community
Learn More...
United States
1353 Posts
 Posted 11/19/2009  1:11 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add bosox to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The subject of them having a website has been broached with them before. They seem to have little interest.

In fact ICCS had a website for a few months about four or five years ago. It was just a couple of general information pages and a submission form that you could download. They abandoned the site after a few months.
http://www.victoriancent.com

2011 & 2025 Fred Bowman Award Winner, 2020 J. Douglas Ferguson Award Winner, & 2022 Paul Fiocca Award Winner. Life Member of RCNA.
Valued Member
Canada
166 Posts
 Posted 11/19/2009  1:12 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add steve kuznicki to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Hello hhbkiddo,

I hope it turns out to be real. If so, I'd like to add it to my personal collection. But I am really taken a back by ICCS' comments that there is no such thing that they have ever graded (considering it is in an ICCS holder). They either made a mistake when they spoke to me or a mistake in labeling the coin. I could be wrong, but I must assume the latter until their is info to the contrary.
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papeldog's Avatar
Canada
1923 Posts
 Posted 11/19/2009  3:47 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add papeldog to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
ICCS are behind times and will probably lose a lot of business over a simple task like building a web site to refer to serial numbers of coins they graded. At least you can purchase a pop book to refer to.
Now for having it available to look at free I hardly think that would happen we live in a dog eat dog world money first. Even PCGS doesn't offer free looks either of the coins they have graded and they don't even have a book to refer to as far as I know. I have a PCGS graded 1944 ms-65 1 cent Canadian coin and to find out how many they have graded it will cost me $10.00 per month bull.
Valued Member
adanak44's Avatar
Canada
207 Posts
 Posted 11/19/2009  4:20 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add adanak44 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
There are no cost for world coin populations from PCGS website.
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papeldog's Avatar
Canada
1923 Posts
 Posted 11/19/2009  5:35 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add papeldog to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Got it thank you
Valued Member
Canada
166 Posts
 Posted 11/19/2009  8:00 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add steve kuznicki to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Does anyone think this is what it says it is and if so why? If there is a chance it is real I will bid on it before it ends in 3 hours.

Thanks,

Steve
Pillar of the Community
Canada
693 Posts
 Posted 11/21/2009  11:11 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add coinsrfun to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The coin is misattributed....with theory's aside.....ICCS sux for this reason....the grade creep and TOTAL lack of customer interest/coutesy/and or concern on their part is almost comical........
Bedrock of the Community
DVCollector's Avatar
United States
10045 Posts
 Posted 11/21/2009  11:59 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add DVCollector to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
In the end, somebody paid $610 for that. Doesn't that seem a tad high for a coin lacking documentation/photos? The label just doesn't clinch it for me.
Edited by DVCollector
11/21/2009 3:00 pm
Valued Member
Canada
166 Posts
 Posted 11/21/2009  12:45 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add steve kuznicki to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Hi DV,

$610 is kind of an odd number. I don't believe that there are even any 1955 ICCS MS65s dollars wdb, let alone PLs of any grade. $610 is 2-3 times what a 1955 wo/db PL65 would go for, but 1/5 - 1/10 what this should bring if it were clearly the genuine, unique item indicated.

Blowing up the picture of the coin, to me at least it does not look 65 (very weak center strike), does not look pl and the die break is not at all evident.

My best guess is that someone made a bad buy(and there was a very limited number of bidders at anything above a token price) and that this was a totally mislabeled coin (it happens, see my note above) and that this is in fact a bullion value of silver coin.

I could be wrong, It could show up at a major auction re-certified and verified. If that happens, I'll personally bid A LOT more than $610.
Pillar of the Community
Canada
693 Posts
 Posted 11/21/2009  2:58 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add coinsrfun to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
When you talked to ICCS, did you confim the Cert #?
Valued Member
Canada
166 Posts
 Posted 11/21/2009  9:38 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add steve kuznicki to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Hi Coinsrfun,

No. I actually called about 3 coins and had the numbers ready for them but they indicated they didn't need them for the questions being asked.

1) I asked about a 1953 dollar I have graded ICCS SP65 SF. I was told that they no longer graded SF 1953's as SP and if it were graded now it would (undoubtedly) grade proof-like. That was exactly the answer I expected.

2) I asked about a 1949 pl64 dollar currently on ebay. I was told that they had graded 1949 dollars pl briefly when the company was started but now only regarded them as MS and the pl had been deleted from the population report for that year. That was exactly the answer I expected.

3) I said I was considering a 1955 arn dollar wdb graded ICCS pl65. I was told that there was no such thing and that all 1955 arn wdb dollars were MS (and less than 65). That was exactly what I expected, but I honestly was disappointed.

I called ICCS with the number ready because I wanted it to be real. I am a serious pl dollar collector (#3 on PCGS registry and have an even better ICCS set) and if it were unique I WANTED IT. 4-5X the selling price would have been very reasonable (perhaps even cheep). But in addition to ICCS' comments, to me in the pictures the coin does not look PL; it does not look 65 (maybe not even MS) and under the highest of magnification I see no die break. I concluded......too good to be true, even though the seller is convinced it is real. Too bad (really). I would have wanted it.
Pillar of the Community
Canada
693 Posts
 Posted 11/22/2009  09:54 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add coinsrfun to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
My 55 Arn is a 63, looks much better than the pics on ebay lolol
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