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 Replies: 15 / Views: 5,857 |
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Valued Member
Canada
51 Posts |
I see quite a few Victoria through George V one cent coins on ebay that look 'shiny' clean but are not accompanied by a grading or even a guess. The seller just doesn't mention it. I have also seen large cents that have a nickel shine to them. Any way to tell if they've actually been cleaned first. Quite a number are from US sellers. Is this a common practise across the border. Thanks |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
2120 Posts |
No, a cleaned coin is cleaned coin, in all its "damaged" glory.
I think just some sellers play opossum to dodge any responsibility they have to report problems on coins to potential sellers.
Usually if it has a wash and even reflection but is stated as a high grade, its probably been cleaned. Look for that luster on high grade coins. It will look like a trumpeted line about 15 degrees wide inversely from the center in opposite directions.
On low grade coins, if its shiny, its a distinct give away.
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Valued Member
Canada
307 Posts |
I agree if it is a shiny coin "new looking" and low grade it has been cleaned or dipped if it is silver.
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Bedrock of the Community
Australia
21788 Posts |
Most ancient coins that have been recovered from burial need cleaning before they are marketed. I collect ancients, but the expertise in cleaning ancients is not based in Australia, where I live. I have seen a few threads on various forums that discuss the cleaning of ancient coins. That may inform me, but I still do not have expertise in cleaning such objects, nor do I require such expertise, although I have been studying ancients for nearly 40 years.
Generally speaking, I don't clean coins at all.
As far as modern coins are concerned, look at as many modern cleaned coins as you can and educate yourself as to what they look like.
If you find a coin that you think you think has been cleaned and if you want it, offer what you think is a pragmatic amount, and if then you don't get it, FORget it; it is not a bargain for you.
I have had a few common VF silver coins that I have cleaned with soap and water, and I have deliberately rubbed some of the patina off with my fingers, and I have definitely improved the eye appeal of them. Because they all have been in no better than VF, there has been no obvious deterioration in wear.
I don't have enough nerve to clean very valuable coins, or coins that are in MS60 or better.
Edited by sel_69l
08/07/2010 08:18 am
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Valued Member
Canada
241 Posts |
Here's a article I have found on the subject, it may help you :
1st NEVER CLEAN OR POLISH COINS
How can one tell when a coin has been cleaned, especially if it was cleaned long ago?
If the coin has been cleaned with an abrasive, the coin will have hairlines. Also, abrasive cleaning often leaves some crud in the recesses of the coin (untouched dirt or left over abrasive).
If the coin has been dipped (Silver) it may or may not be detectable,but it sometimes leaves the coin bright on high grade coins.On lower grade coins you get a light steel grey tone like cloudy milky water. Also dipping can strip the lustre off the coin, with the end result that there is no lustre where you would expect it to be for a coin in said condition (EF and better coins).
A natural coin has a particular appearance which reflects the history of its storage. Haphazardly stored coins tend to have a "dirty" appearance to the toning. Coins that have lived for a long time in a coin cabinet tend to have spectacular coloured toning. Coins stored in a clean metal vault (such as an old style "piggy" bank) may stay white (or red) for a long time. Coins stored in albums develop either the familiar "ring toning" (slide type albums) or the much less desireable "one sided toning" (all cardboard albums). Coins stored in mint bags often show spectacular rainbow toning, similar to that seen on coins stored in coin cabinets.
Copper/bronze/brass coins that have been cleaned have an unnatural colour, often looking like a toned gold coin. Even after they retone, they tend it tends to be uneven and a slightly odd colour (watch out for dark areas). See that red in the recesses of that VF copper coin? Not a good sign! Naturally toned, *circulated* copper tends to be very uniform in colour, although they might be dark and dirty around the lettering and similar protected areas. Uncirculated copper may tone very unevenly (especially proofs), so do not automatically count this against such a coin.
Exactly the other way around, silver coins that have been cleaned tend to be extremely uniform in colour after they retone, including the tops of the letters and protected areas. Silver coins with natural toning will usually show some variation in the colour at these places. Be aware that a uniform slate grey colour can be produced on silver very easily with a number of chemicals. Finally, a heavily toned and subsequently dipped silver coin will tend to have a grey milk like colour/ appearance caused by surface roughness rather than tarnish. This can be detected by careful examination with a strong magnifier.
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
3692 Posts |
When I notice cleaning it's in the form of tiny scratches going in parallel lines or in circles. And if there is dirt/gunk around raised parts of a field but nowhere else, then it has most likely been cleaned. Also most people don't check the rims/edges. Even lots of AU coins look amazing until you see the standard finger spots on the edges.
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Valued Member
Canada
168 Posts |
Check to see if the seller has other coins for sale. If they are lower grades and all are spotless, you can be pretty sure they clean their coins. A few ebay sellers plate their coins too so check for off-colour coins as well. |
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
650 Posts |
When you said that you were looking at a penny that had a nickle shine to it. Do you mean like a shinny penny red, or do you mean it was like a nickle?
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Valued Member
United States
211 Posts |
Over the years my father bought a lot of silver dollars through mail auctions and coin shows. As I have gone through his collection and learned he bought many coins labeled BU that turned out to be horribly disfigured by minute polishing marks. As I sell off many of these coins on ebay, I make sure there is always a disclaimer stating the coin is cleaned and the light in the photo emphasizes the cleaning marks. These coins still hold some value, because an 1858 20¢ is still an 1858 20¢, a part of Canadian history. Just because some grandfather buffed the coin for his grandson in the next century - it still retains its place in the coin story.  |
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Valued Member
Canada
307 Posts |
Quote:
These coins still hold some value, because an 1858 20¢ is still an 1858 20¢, a part of Canadian history. Just because some grandfather buffed the coin for his grandson in the next century - it still retains its place in the coin story. I do agree with this statement. The coin grade would would not change as long as the cleaning has not wore the surfaces....but the coin would have to carry the additional statement of Cleaned and that will in most cases lower the actual value of the coin. A harder date would still carry a premium just not as much as it should and a common date would have no value over face. |
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
1248 Posts |
I had a coin returned which I sent in for a friend from a TPG markedas cleaned and polished. The coin had been in a pant or jacket pocket for years as a good luck charm. (1948 50 cent piece, his birth year). The coin traveled with its Owner, a commercial pilot, with him on every flight he ever did. Many years of pocket wear and friction made the coin look shiny. There was guaranteed NO cleaning or artificially polishing on this coin. It was clean as a whistle. only natural and normal wear had occurred. there were NO whizzing marks or hair lines visible under 20 times magnification. My question now is: Was the TPG,s remark: cleaned and polished correct or not? |
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Pillar of the Community
 Canada
9865 Posts |
IMO the TPG's comment was correct,they have no idea how the coin became polished,better that they err on the side of caution.Are you absolutely certain there were no whizzing marks? coins in the pocket can sometimes be subject to a little accidental whizzing. |
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Valued Member
 Canada
51 Posts |
MrCanada - shiny like a nickle.
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
1248 Posts |
the coin has this shiny worn look... from the pockets...and the many thousands of miles it traveled. IMO, most TPG'S are too fast with their statement. I had a TPG send a coin back as cleaned..... 4 months later the same coin, cut out and re-submitted, came back as MS62. you decide.... |
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
650 Posts |
Shinny like a nickle , that is strange , it could be mercury , or plated, don't lick your fingers.
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Valued Member
Canada
311 Posts |
Mr. Canada, Along with coin collecting for about 50 years, I have metal detected for about 25 of that. I have dug up a couple of pennies that were definitely silver in color, and I have chalked it up to the mineral in the ground around the coin. I wonder if this could be a possibility for the silver looking penny. take care,
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Replies: 15 / Views: 5,857 |
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Posted 08/06/2010 2:11 pm
