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1970 S LMC, PMD, No Premium, But How Did They Do It?

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United States
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 Posted 05/12/2011  02:39 am Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add jmkendall to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
*** Moved by Staff to a more appropriate forum. ***

I pulled this out of a register in 1970. At the time we lived about 20 miles from SF. It looks like there is a complete second impression rotated cw at the 1 o'clock position, using the center of Lincolns head as the reference point. And perhaps a third impression at the 2 o'clock position. You can see the out of place "1" between the 9 and 7. Liberty is similiarly done, with the "L" in liberty also being the most noticeable. And of course all the letter around the rim has a double impression as well. The reverse is normal.

1970-S-LMC,-PMD,-No-Premium,-But-How-Did-They-Do-It?
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Pinenut's Avatar
United States
462 Posts
 Posted 05/12/2011  05:53 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Pinenut to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
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BadThad's Avatar
United States
19968 Posts
 Posted 05/12/2011  09:12 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add BadThad to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Could be a rotated, capped die, a deteriored die OR some odd PMD. Post it in the errors/varieties forum for the experts. If it's an error, it could be a valuable coin.
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Adam_E's Avatar
United States
4846 Posts
 Posted 05/12/2011  09:25 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Adam_E to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
although it looks like there is a second lincoln bust, there is not.

My first guess would be acid, I've seen a couple of acid-dipped cents and they look sort of like this.

my second guess would be a late stage die cap as pinenut said.
Edited by Adam_E
05/12/2011 09:26 am
Pillar of the Community
United States
1590 Posts
 Posted 05/12/2011  10:29 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add jmkendall to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Actually, there is a second bust. Also note the "O" under the "0" in the date. And what I identified as a stray one between the 9 and 7, I now realize is the top of the second 7, then the top of the second 9 is over the one in the date. and a faint "1" can be seen to the left of the one in the date. Also you can make out the faint mintmark of the second impression under the one in the date. I wish I could get a better shot of "Liberty" as you can see the second, rotated, impression there very well.

I would rather not put it in the error section as I will undoubtedly get the usual response; PMD, why are you wasting our time. If I start out as PMD and it turns out to be something else, then great, but right now I am just interested in how it was made.

Thanks!
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Dave42's Avatar
United States
571 Posts
 Posted 05/12/2011  12:20 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Dave42 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Since the reverse is normal, I would rule out acid dipped. It actually looks like it was struck through a late stage die cap to me. I'm no expert, but if it is, that's a very nice find!

Dave
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biokemist6's Avatar
United States
12437 Posts
 Posted 05/12/2011  12:42 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add biokemist6 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
LOL, that is not PMD You have a coin that was struck through a late stage capped die. The process starts when a coin adheres to a die, that coin then begins to act like a new die itself. The first few strikes produce very valuable mirror image brockages.
1970-S-LMC,-PMD,-No-Premium,-But-How-Did-They-Do-It?
As more strikes occur, the brockage spreads out and becomes less distinct because the die cap thins out and wraps around the die shank, obliterating the detail of the die cap. The die detail begins to be transferred to the struck coins again but it is still being struck through a thin piece of metal(the die cap) so the detail has a soft mushy appearance to it. The die cap can also rotate while coins are being struck which can result in a multi-image transfer.
1970-S-LMC,-PMD,-No-Premium,-But-How-Did-They-Do-It?
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reupman's Avatar
United States
597 Posts
 Posted 05/12/2011  5:54 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add reupman to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
i love learning new stuff.
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nickelsearcher's Avatar
United States
15489 Posts
 Posted 05/12/2011  8:50 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add nickelsearcher to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Sorry I missed this in time to reply with an informed answer ...

biokemist6 has it nailed along with a fabulous description of how a capped die degenerates over time and the resultant coins produced by such an error.

Great coin ... 1970-S LMC (Large Date BTW) struck through a late stage capped die.

The fun part for us roll searchers is that there are many more of the same coin out there ... and the ever elusive first few strikes of the capped die that have produced mirror image coins show in biokemist6 great reply.

Pleased the Mod Dudes moved your post here where we can offer our views.

David
Take a look at my other hobby ... http://www.jk-dk.art
Pillar of the Community
United States
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 Posted 05/12/2011  11:26 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add jmkendall to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Thank You, one and all. That was the most educational answer I have gotten to a question I have posed on here! I am sincerely grateful!
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biokemist6's Avatar
United States
12437 Posts
 Posted 05/12/2011  11:38 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add biokemist6 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
That is definitely a nice error, IMO it is a much nicer error than a relatively common clipped planchet or off-center strike. Value would probably be around $10 but personally I would pay a little more* since it is a Memorial S mint, much less common compared to the average P or D Lincoln Memorial.

*Not an actual offer to buy, only a hypothetical scenario:)
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