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Collecting Conundrum

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barryg's Avatar
United States
5855 Posts
 Posted 08/11/2011  4:01 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add barryg to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
Hey, Guys!

So I've been diligently trying to fill my Dansco 7070 US Type Album and have run into a bit of a conundrum as I've gotten down to the last handful of coins. Right now, all I have left are the Draped Bust Large Cent, the Classic Head Large Cent, the Liberty Standing quarter (Variety I) and the Liberty Seated dollar (No Motto). If I want to find examples that are actually recognizable for what they are, I expect to pay at least a couple of hundred dollars apiece for these.

That, in and of itself, doesn't bother me too much (I figure I can budget buying one every month or so). No, the problem is that if I'm going to buy a coin for that much money, I feel like I should really get one that has been graded and slabbed by a TPG. Otherwise, there's just no way to tell for sure that I'm not getting ripped off with a replica or something. But if I get a slabbed coin, it won't fit in my album!!

I suppose I have three choices:

1. Take a chance on raw coins and hope for the best.

2. Buy slabbed coins and then remove them from the slabs.

3. Buy really low grade examples that hopefully will still be distinguishable for what they are.

Any thoughts? I'm not looking to buy all MS or AU coins, but for a type album I really feel like you should be able to see all the key distinguishing features.
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nwc coin's Avatar
United States
516 Posts
 Posted 08/11/2011  4:06 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add nwc coin to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Use the vast knowledge of many members on the board. If you find examples of coins you like, capture the image and post it here for thoughts.. Seems like there is enough expertise to determine authenticity most of the time for any given coin. People can also point out any potential problems that you may have missed.

Or, crack them out of slabs. I've done that with quite a few coins on my 7070. I have no regrets about doing it.
Valued Member
United States
123 Posts
 Posted 08/11/2011  4:08 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add John Bonzo to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I would choose #1 and only buy from a reputable dealer. Is there a coin shop dealer that you have developed a relationship with?

#2 is not bad either; you just end up paying a premium for the grade. I have no problem taking coins out of slab. It's not like you are buying these with the intention of reselling.

#3 is the least appealing option to me.
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barryg's Avatar
United States
5855 Posts
 Posted 08/11/2011  4:13 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add barryg to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I've visited a couple of local dealers and, while I'm sure they are honest, they're prices seem ridiculously high.

And yes, the problem is buying slabbed coins is that you end up paying a huge premium above the coin's "actual" value just for the peace of mind. Of course, peace of mind can't be overrated, I suppose...

I think I will take you guys up on the offer to post potential examples off ebay when I find them. That really sounds like the best option of all!
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rjkingston's Avatar
United States
642 Posts
 Posted 08/11/2011  4:19 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add rjkingston to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
You can navigate purchasing raw coins safely with enough experience. Especially with buyer protection and good return policies.

I would go with option #1, but don't leave it up to hope or chance Navigate cautiously.
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yankee1227's Avatar
United States
1151 Posts
 Posted 08/11/2011  4:23 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add yankee1227 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
If you see something that you arent sure about, you can post it on here because there is at least one person who collects those.
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jbuck's Avatar
United States
188740 Posts
 Posted 08/11/2011  5:51 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add jbuck to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
You actually listed your three options in the correct order.

1. Take a chance on raw coins and hope for the best.

No need to take a chance. Research, research, research! If you take your time, the right coin will come along and you will know it is the right one.

2. Buy slabbed coins and then remove them from the slabs.

Although I would personally prefer the first option, this is probably the most likely scenario. Nothing wrong with it, just make sure to follow through and crack the slab! You do not want to look at an empty hole, or you would not have posted this topic!

3. Buy really low grade examples that hopefully will still be distinguishable for what they are.

The worst case scenario, of course, but an acceptable one if you know what to sacrifice. Low grade because of honest wear, yes. Low grade from damage or other problems, not so much.
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delaner's Avatar
United States
870 Posts
 Posted 08/11/2011  9:02 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add delaner to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I saw a 1797 DBLC with a readable date sell on ebay for $15 ($18 including shipping) yesterday - almost bought it. If you're truly interested in the series in question, get hole fillers and upgrade - you'll learn a LOT about the series in the process. Which for me is the fun part!! I have a couple of classic heads I don't need (problem coins, hole fillers) I'll sell you cheap if you're interested. Oh wait, you're new... can't do that. Anyway, maybe when you've been around a bit I can! =)

If not, save up and go for the gusto. Is your 7070 a grade set?
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barryg's Avatar
United States
5855 Posts
 Posted 08/11/2011  10:30 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add barryg to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
By "grade set" do you mean trying to get all the coins in the same grade? If so, no. I'm trying to keep it affordable and also trying to find the best (most recognizable) examples I can afford. Some of my newer coins are probably in MS grade, but the older ones are, well, about what you' expect.
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United States
751 Posts
 Posted 08/12/2011  12:01 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add texasmick to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I'm with you, Barry. There is something very satisfying about filling holes. And upgrading is rewarding too. Buying a shiny "high grade" coin that turns out to be cleaned or whizzed can be heart-breaking. Take it slow and build up to the premium stuff IMO.
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barryg's Avatar
United States
5855 Posts
 Posted 08/12/2011  08:40 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add barryg to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Since I'm primarily buying these to fill my Type album and not for investment (don't tell my wife that, though), I'm less concerned with buying coins that may be over-graded and/or cleaned and more concerned with buying coins that are outright fakes (although I do avoid the coins that are mysteriously super-shiny while still having plenty of pits and scratches). The more I read on this forum, the more paranoid I am getting. In fact, I just took a magnet to my entire collection (fortunately, only the 1943 penny was attracted to it).

I'm not too worried about my Morgans, Barbers, and more recent coins. But now that I'm looking at stuff like Trade dollars, early Seated Liberty dollars and early Large Cents, well, it seems like these get faked a lot. I can barely afford to buy decent-looking specimens of these coins in the first place, so it would break my heart (not to mention my bank) to spend hundreds of dollars on a single coin and later find out it was a fake.

Anyway, thanks for the advice. If I see any potential candidates on places like ebay, I'll be sure to post them here for your opinions. Except, it looks like I need a lot more "quality" posts before I'm allowed to do that...
Rest in Peace
johnny54321's Avatar
United States
4849 Posts
 Posted 08/12/2011  10:09 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add johnny54321 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The 7070 is a lot of fun! I have pulled many a coin out of the slab to fill it. Here is my opinion.

Seated and Trade dollars are the most heavily counterfeited. As a result, these would be the ones I would be very wary buying raw.

The Classic and Draped Bust Cent don't seem to be as heavily counterfeited, so your less likely to run into a fake. The bigger issue for me, imo, is that a lot of these have corrosion issues or have been recolored....so buying slabbed would help eliminate potential problems if you care about that kind of stuff.

The type 1 standing lib quarter, I think your fine buying this raw for the most part...just watch out for cleaned examples.
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barryg's Avatar
United States
5855 Posts
 Posted 08/12/2011  12:55 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add barryg to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Right now, I suspect the Type 1 Standing Liberty quarter may end up being the one coin I don't end up putting in my album. I recently got a decent 1871 Seated Liberty dollar for around $175. It's pretty worn (you can't really make out "Liberty" on the shield or "In God We Trust" on the reverse), but it's at least recognizable for what it is. Similarly, I hope to find an earlier example without the motto for around $200-300 in the same condition. And I'm sure if I look around I can find both early Large Cents in the $100-200 range. The point is that I don't need to have a coin with every detail crisp, as long as the key elements are there and you can tell what it is.

When it comes to Standing Liberty quarters, however, the key difference between type 1 and type 2 is whether the breast is exposed or whether she is wearing chain mail. I can't even afford a type 2 in good enough condition to clearly see the chain mail let alone a type 1 where I can make out the exposed breast. The ones I have seen tend to sell for upwards of $500 (often much more) and I just can't justify (to my wife, let alone to myself) spending that amount of money for a "non-investment" (ungraded, not in a slab) coin. Of course, as I tell my wife, while having a coin graded and slabbed certainly increases the value and makes it more likely to appreciate in value, a good raw coin will at least keep its value over time since there will always be collectors looking for them.
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jbuck's Avatar
United States
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 Posted 08/12/2011  3:15 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add jbuck to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Right now, I suspect the Type 1 Standing Liberty quarter may end up being the one coin I don't end up putting in my album
I do not understand. The 1916 is not the only option here. The 1917 Type I Standing Liberty quarters are very affordable...

http://www.numismedia.com/fmv/price...icesgd.shtml

I would not worry about seeing or not seeing the differences on the observe. The obverse is not the only difference between the two types. Three of the reverse side stars were moved to be below the eagle on the second type.

Really, there are actually three types if you count the recessed date that started in 1925 (but the 7070 does not make this distinction).
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barryg's Avatar
United States
5855 Posts
 Posted 08/12/2011  3:55 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add barryg to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Thanks for the feedback, jbuck! Yes, I'm aware of the difference on the reverse with the stars, but in my personal opinion it really is the obverse that is the critical difference, since supposedly the whole reason for the redesign was to cover up the breast.

The NusmisMedia price guide is very interesting, but doesn't come close to reflecting the prices I have seen at local dealers and on ebay. Maybe if I started hitting the coin shows I could find more reasonable prices, but so far for the level of detail I would like I'm seeing prices above well above $200 mark. But I will keep looking!
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jbuck's Avatar
United States
188740 Posts
 Posted 08/12/2011  6:16 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add jbuck to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Definitely keep looking! The coin show is a great idea (I buy all of my coins at shows). The competition should keep the prices inline with what NumisMedia is showing.

Be positive! You will fill that hole with a satisfactory specimen and it will not be the most expensive coin you bought for the 7070.
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