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 Replies: 33 / Views: 4,216 |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
6326 Posts |
I just got the notification that 2 of these are now shipped for me. Problem is.......I forgot that I had this subscription for these ! .......  I normally only order the Proof ASE's, but I remember now that when the "Proof" wasn't being offered, that I changed my subscription for the Uncirc's., back in 2009 I believe. Now after the two year hiatus of these.....here's my order showing up ! .....  Now, it's not that I don't WANT these two ASE's, it's just that I'm paying $120.00 ( plus shipping/handling) for them. My coin shop guy has repeatedly told me that because of the high silver and gold prices, you won't get the premiums on top of spot price for Modern Proof gold or silver. And of course they won't offer full spot price either, because they have to make money too. So, if I were real LUCKY, a dealer MIGHT give me around $30.00 for my 2011 Burnished Uncirculated Silver Eagle...?...or $60.00 FOR BOTH OF THEM ! Were they Proofs.....I wouldn't sell those anyway so those wouldn't matter to me, or don't figure in here. But, basically, am I figuring all of this right ? ....  .... as soon as I have these two ASE's in my hand.....they'll only be worth less than HALF OF WHAT I ONLY JUST PAID FOR THEM ? ....  I'm wondering why I would pay a hefty premium over melt for ASE's that are not even the "Bullion" ASE's ! (bullion '11's would be so much cheaper at least!) Anybody else struggling with this on these ?Edited by eaglefoot
09/16/2011 2:57 pm
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Valued Member
United States
368 Posts |
I think you are forgetting the limited mintage and numismatic factors.
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Pillar of the Community
 United States
6326 Posts |
Quote:
numismatic factors Well.....that's why I typically ONLY collect the Proofs. And the Proof ASE's are one of the most beautiful coins on Earth to me. But, the difficulty is "my budget" doesn't really allow this, so I have to be careful. It comes down to "intrinsic value versus numismatic value", or in this case, a combination of BOTH for me, I think. Since I'm going to be ordering the Proof ASE's soon......I question whether or not this is a SMART buy for me. (And, I wasn't aware of an especially low mintage for these.....didn't think that was a factor for the 2011 vs. previous years) |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
7192 Posts |
And then what are you going to do when (or if) they issue a 25th anniversary set with a new reversed proof only available in the set. This requires you to purchase again another proof and burnished eagle if you are to complete your proof set with the reversed proof. I will not "subscribe" to mint offerings and purchase the ones I want when they become available.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
6326 Posts |
Well, my plan was to always continue getting every regular Proof ASE each and every year (i started collecting them in 2007) This "special" Set with the Reverse Proof will be something seperate, that doesn't factor in to my collecting of the regular Proofs. I don't have an ASE Dansco or anything....won't ever get one most likely. I like the little cases these come in ! And I will have to try getting 1996 through 2006 someday when the budget allows. For now, though, I just get a couple Proofs each and every year. So, similar to the Lincoln Coin and Chronicles Set.....I already had the Proof Lincoln Silver Dollar (2), and the Copper Lincoln Cents, but got a couple of these Sets anyway. Basically because this Set was "special" and had it's own numismatic value to me as a "separate" entity. This is the way I will look at the 5 Coin ASE Set as well....a "must have"......but quite separate from regular ASE Proofs that I collect yearly. Edited by eaglefoot
09/16/2011 1:01 pm
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Pillar of the Community
United States
6326 Posts |
Basically....IMO..."Silver flippers" would never buy Proofs or Burnished Uncirc's.....they want "Bullion", and it's less about "numismatics" than it is about flipping a profit. I am not one of these folks. But for me here, I question whether I should have cancelled my order of these, since apparently, they're not even worth "HALF" of what I just paid for them. It "DOES" please me to own them, however, but money doesn't grow on trees here where I live, and it doesn't seem like "SMART" money to have spent. I just wonder if anyone else has a similar existing circumstance with these 2011 ASE's, paralleling the bad economy and such. (and a very limited budget) Like a ..... "What to do ?"......or a "What should I have done?" kind of thing. (mine is of course the latter!) Edited by eaglefoot
09/16/2011 2:56 pm
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Pillar of the Community
United States
4901 Posts |
Quote:
Basically....IMO..."Silver flippers" would never buy Proofs or Burnished Uncirc's.....they want "Bullion", and it's less about "numismatics" than it is about flipping a profit. I am not one of these folks.
But for me here, I question whether I should have cancelled my order of these, since apparently, they're not even worth "HALF" of what I just paid for them. 1st point correct....but you really shouldn't equate these with the bullion variety..BIG difference... 2nd point...?... since they are not being sold as bullion how can you know what they are worth until you sell them (as the W's they are NOT as bullion) You have a conflict between intrinsic value and numismatic value...the intrinsic value of a MS 70 2008-W rev of 2007 is around $40..the numismatic value is around $700 Apples and oranges |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1817 Posts |
That's the main reason I refuse to subscribe to the Mint's annual offerings, there is no incentive to do so and one invariably 'forgets' what one subscribes to in the first place. It's a dangerous practice for someone on a limited budget, IMO. If the Mint was willing to lock in prices for a five or ten year term for a subscription, that might be doable, but as it is, it's not worth the hassle and then get surprised when the credit card is charged or when the box shows up. You could always return the coins back & be only out the $4.95 & return shipping, instead of feeling cheated by the $125.00 cost, if it is not a good use of money to you. & make sure you cancel the subscription while you're at it, so you aren't 'surprised' in 2012.  Edit-- Actually, if you are really uncomfortable with the cost, you could refuse the box altogether. The shipper would have to mark the shipment as undeliverable or refused, and continue the tracking back to the origin. As it was never delivered to you, the Mint would have to refund ALL your money, not just for the two coins. You changed your mind, that's a legitimate reason to refuse a delivery. Edited by Bizybackson
09/17/2011 12:23 am
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Valued Member
United States
301 Posts |
So return them. You'd take a much smaller hit if you just returned them to the mint than you would if you sold them for below spot price.
I kind of like the mint's subscription service. I got the 2011 proof via subscription. Didn't have to worry about jumping on it before they sold out. I also have a subscription for the 2011-W. I have not gotten confirmation of shipment yet though.
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Bedrock of the Community
 United States
12839 Posts |
I like the subscriptions too; have most of them. Looks like a "subscription" for ASE's is only for 1 year (i.e., you have to renew it each year)? How is that a subscription vs. a pre-order? |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
4901 Posts |
Quote:Looks like a "subscription" for ASE's is only for 1 year (i.e., you have to renew it each yea I have had the same subscription for ten W's since 2006 and you do not have to renew. Just make sure your CC is not past expiration. I will add three things for the poster with buyers remorse... 1)the Mint did send out a notification stating that my subscription would soon be filled...plenty of time to cancel if desired...even after the issue date the cancel box was there for a couple of days...plenty of time to cancel 2) I have been buying and selling these since they came out in '06...I have NEVER sold them at or near spot and have done quite well with graded specimens 3) you can just send them back and check "Changed my mind" on the return receipt. It is an accepted reason for return. Not worth losing sleep over... |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
4541 Posts |
i would get 1 but since its going to be in the 25th set I am passing. ask your dealer if he is going to sell that modern set from the mint at a little premium
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Pillar of the Community
United States
6326 Posts |
Quote:
2nd point...?... since they are not being sold as bullion how can you know what they are worth until you sell them (as the W's they are NOT as bullion)
You have a conflict between intrinsic value and numismatic value...the intrinsic value of a MS 70 2008-W rev of 2007 is around $40..the numismatic value is around $700
No...no.....maybe I wasn't clear. I'm quite aware of the '07 status ASE's And, only speaking of my local coin shops....they won't pay anything "extra" for a coin being "proof", because, they say, of the high prices right now in silver and gold. I sold a Proof '06 $50.00 Buffalo a while back....same deal.....the "proof" part of my coin was not recognized....only the days "spot price". Do you see what I mean ? And so by "smart money" in purchasing these two Burnished Eagles (that I don't collect typically), and the "proof" or "burnished" qualities NOT being recognized..... THEY ARE BEING TREATED AS "SPOT PRICE" BULLION MATERIALS. So "intrinsic" and "numismatic" DO overlap and interfere ! I have first hand experience with it happening regretfully ! ....  So, assuming that my two Burnished ASE's are not going to have some other years' reverse or whatever....they're worth no more than a BULLION ASE. (And I say this only in regards to face to face coin shop dealers here in Kansas) ..... I know nothing of ebay or anything in that realm at all....where I'm sure better deals can be had.....or NOT) |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
6326 Posts |
I will keep both of them for now, by the way. But if and when I go to sell or trade them......I fear I will take quite a hit in issue price vs in-store value. Even if I sell them the very day they arrive into my hands. (unless silver goes to $200.00 an oz. of course !) ...  |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
3755 Posts |
What I am getting here is that your local shop considers all ASEs as simple bullion silver and wont pay otherwise. The main shop we go to the owner is the same way. So be it. That does not make them correct. Nor does it make your coins wrth less than half what you paid. I really my shop owner, but he is dead wrong on this one as is your shop owner. Even the "bullion" coins are worth more than melt if they are high grade. So simply do not plan on selling to that shop. But as pointed out, why didnt you cancel when the notification email came out? I got mine several weeks ago. Completely forgot about it though and was taken back by the 65 bucks coming out of the account. LOL First time I bought an ASE I paid 20 bucks for it...only 5 years ago. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
4901 Posts |
If your local "coin" shop pays only spot or less for numismatic coins then it has become a metals dealer and not a coin shop. While the spot price does negate most numismatic premium there are some issues that still have more value than the metal they contain.
When you decide to sell ANY coins get a new buyer..one that buys coins
p.s. that said .....this issue will probably not be a money maker since it will also be issued in the 5 coin set and most likely in a dollar set packaged with the $1 coins of 2011.
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Replies: 33 / Views: 4,216 |
Posted 09/16/2011 12:12 pm
