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 Replies: 138 / Views: 19,695 |
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Bedrock of the Community
13014 Posts |
Quote:
Get it straight from Antietam Coin (Rich) - here...
Do you want me to find Ray's email and ask if he minds your contacting him? I won't be contacting either of them. You've made the public claims and should be willing to support the claims. Do you just blindly believe whatever a dealer says if it supports your own bias? I would have known everything I have asked you to provide before ever considering repeating it to someone else |
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
12057 Posts |
Arguments in extremis such as "TPG's are (mostly) infallible when it comes to grading" and "TPG's always (usually) get it wrong when it comes to grading" are appeals to ignorance -- you can't ask for objective proof of something that's subjective, such as a coin's grade, nor use an absence of evidence to meet a burden of proof.
Statements such as "Most coin dealers overgrade their inventory" are equally ridiculous and intrinsically unprovable, yet they seem to get tossed about with abandon. It's an empty argument -- (can you define "most?") -- but here on the Internet we're all often guilty of presenting opinions as facts.
I think it is well-established in this thread by now that some coin shops DO overgrade and some coin shops do NOT overgrade, and equally well established that both overgrading and undergrading can occur in a single shop, with or without the dealer's intent. That's an opinion, not a fact, because it is subjective, not objective. Trying to quantify "some" is a pointless exercise in unprovable arguments.
Member ANA - EAC - TNA - SSDC - CCT #890 "Most of the things worth doing in the world had been declared impossible before they were done." -- Louis D. Brandeis |
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
10038 Posts |
Basebal, I politely request your sources please.
Edited by Earle42
05/07/2018 11:36 pm
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Bedrock of the Community
13014 Posts |
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Basebal, I politely request your sources please. So once again you refuse to say who they graded for and when. ASE submission rates have data all over the place and plenty of MASSIVE submitter who discuss it on the various forums. I don't do research for free in areas where anyone can actually look around and find it. The burden of proof is on you, and this is my problem with your rumors you never back them up claiming they cap grades at a certain rate. Edited by basebal21
05/08/2018 12:22 am
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
1267 Posts |
Quote: And they both quit grading for the TPG b/c they did not want their own reputations to be hindered by association if the facts were known. I'm curious as to which TPG's they worked for. Accugrade? Mark Feld, NGC grader at one time, now I believe with pinnacle rarities is certainly not ashamed of the reference. I don't believe that John Albanese is ashamed of his association with NGC either. I have a good friend whose son is a PCGS grader. Dad, who worked for spectrum and superior galleries, is quite proud of him. Seems to me that their reputations were actually enhanced by the association with reputable TPG's. |
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Bedrock of the Community
 United States
12477 Posts |
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So once again you refuse to say who they graded for and when. No. Earle42 said he does not know: Quote:
I don't know the specific company(ies?) either man graded for. When is a moot point if you don't know where.Follow the discussion and read the posts. Otherwise, there is no point to any of this. In Memory of Crazyb0 12-26-1951 to 7-27-2020
In Memory of Tootallious 3-31-1964 to 4-15-2020
In Memory of T-BOP 10-12-1949 to 1-19-2024
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Bedrock of the Community
13014 Posts |
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No. Earle42 said he does not know:
I'm well aware of that and have been for months, which is the entire point. This story he keeps repeating ad nauseam is the numismatic equivalent of a guy at the local dive bar telling a woman hes an out of town multi millionaire CEO trying to pick her up. We're supposedly supposed to just believe all this because someone said it once somewhere and now it gets typed despite evidence against what has been said. Quote: Mark Feld, NGC grader at one time, now I believe with pinnacle rarities is certainly not ashamed of the reference. I don't believe that John Albanese is ashamed of his association with NGC either. I have a good friend whose son is a PCGS grader. Dad, who worked for spectrum and superior galleries, is quite proud of him. Seems to me that their reputations were actually enhanced by the association with reputable TPG's. Exactly. JA was PCGS as well and Capt on the CU boards is proud of his work at ANACS back in the day as well and there are several more examples than just that. Many of the ANA teachers are current or former TPG graders ect. It's a huge boost to someones reputation in numismatics to have a prestigious position like that with the possible exception of being fired for being incompetent. Edited by basebal21
05/08/2018 03:34 am
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
12477 Posts |
You have a list of former and current TPG graders? I am really questioning your association with any of the TPGs, Basebal21. You wanted names. I gave you a name (confirmed accurate) that you wanted someone else to provide to you. I don't understand your purpose in all of this, what you want to prove, or who you want to support/defame. I am going to ask, along Earle42, what are your sources? Earle has provided at least two individual sources, and you, Basebal21, have provided nothing. I am not biased in this, but I recognize that you, basebal21, lack any evidence of any type to support anything.  So, then...  In Memory of Crazyb0 12-26-1951 to 7-27-2020
In Memory of Tootallious 3-31-1964 to 4-15-2020
In Memory of T-BOP 10-12-1949 to 1-19-2024
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Bedrock of the Community
13014 Posts |
Quote:You have a list of former and current TPG graders? Several of them post on CU including active TPG graders. NGC forums have Mark Field posting as another example and some of the CU ones also post there. It's common knowledge they do this not a secret and none of them are ashamed of the work they did/do or where they worked/work. It would be foolish of me not to note the ones that have been confirmed to do this and pay attention to their posts. I've told Earl to post his story there with names and see what happens but he hasn't that I have seen. If you want to believe him that's on you, as I said I cannot stop anyone from being stubbornly misinformed Edited by basebal21
05/08/2018 04:11 am
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
12477 Posts |
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I'm well aware of that and have been for months, which is the entire point. So, you choose to waste others' time. If you know the answer, don't ask the question. It's not helping anyone. The "entire point" is that you and Earle42 don't agree about anything. Maybe take it to a side room somewhere. I suggest calming down. Think about what's important to you. If you can't do that, then you are in for a lot of battles and you will lose most of them. But, what do I know?  In Memory of Crazyb0 12-26-1951 to 7-27-2020
In Memory of Tootallious 3-31-1964 to 4-15-2020
In Memory of T-BOP 10-12-1949 to 1-19-2024
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Bedrock of the Community
13014 Posts |
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It's not helping anyone. The "entire point" is that you and Earle42 don't agree about anything. No it's not, it's that he's spreading rumors as if they are fact and will not back them up when evidence all around shows it's wrong. If he came in with his opinion about how he hates the TPGs and grading that is one thing and something he often does, but once he tries to claim inside information from former graders he better back that up |
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
12477 Posts |
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he's spreading rumors as if they are fact and will not back them up when evidence all around shows it's wrong You, Basebal21, do the same in distributing "facts" without evidence. Re-evaluation time? I think so. You refuse to address sources for ideas. Earle42 has provided much more evidence than you have in this case. I have not seen you back up anything in this topic with fact, Basebal21. Ideas? In Memory of Crazyb0 12-26-1951 to 7-27-2020
In Memory of Tootallious 3-31-1964 to 4-15-2020
In Memory of T-BOP 10-12-1949 to 1-19-2024
Edited by spru
05/08/2018 04:32 am
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Bedrock of the Community
13014 Posts |
Quote:
Earle42 has provided much more evidence than you have in this case. No he hasn't but this will be the last time I address a pointless post like this. Saying one time at band camp I heard this is not evidence. Believe what you want you aren't why I call him out. I just do not want people reading to think that they should believe someone who basically says hey I have no details but I once might have had someone trying to sell me things say this so it must be true because I want it to be There's plenty of posts and posters if someone wants to know how the TPGs actually work from people that did/do work there, I would suggest doing that. It takes less than 5 minutes to find a bunch from the actual graders Edited by basebal21
05/08/2018 04:40 am
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Pillar of the Community
United States
8715 Posts |
Basebal21, you seem to blindly support TPGs even if they are incorrect. I agree that TPGs are useful, but they are human, and occasionally make mistakes. They may overgrade or undergrade here and there. Therefore, saying that TPGs are always right makes no sense.
Earle42 has asked for your sources but you refuse to give them to him. Why is that?
Edited by SilverDollar2017
05/08/2018 09:04 am
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
12057 Posts |
Member ANA - EAC - TNA - SSDC - CCT #890 "Most of the things worth doing in the world had been declared impossible before they were done." -- Louis D. Brandeis |
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Replies: 138 / Views: 19,695 |
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Posted 05/07/2018 10:20 pm
