Coin Community Family of Web Sites
Shop CCF Members on eBay! Specializing in Modern Numismatics Shop for APMEX Bullion on eBay!300,000 items to help build your collection! Coin, Banknote and Medal Collectors's Online Mall Vancouvers #1 Coin and Paper Money Dealer Royal Canadian Mint products, Canadian, Polish, American, and world coins and banknotes.








Username:
Password:
Save Password
Forgot your Password?


This page may contain links that result in small commissions to keep this free site up and running.

Welcome Guest! Registering and/or logging in will remove the anchor (bottom) ads. It's Free!

Warning To Consigners Of Auctions. In Many Cases, Sales Can Be Reversed At Any Time.

To participate in the forum you must log in or register.
Author Previous TopicReplies: 6 / Views: 574Next Topic  
Valued Member

Canada
191 Posts
 Posted 04/15/2024  11:52 am Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add recollector to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
I posted an experience I had on another thread here but I think it bears repeating as a new topic for the sake of warning new collectors who want to consign to an auction house.

I consigned a raw coin to great collections auction house, the auction house sent it to PCGS and CAC and it was then graded and sold. For whatever reason, the buyer returned the coin, as he or she believed it was incorrectly attributed. (The grading companies apparently missed the weak S mint mark.) The coin was returned and the sale was reversed. Naturally the grading companies did not claim responsibility and no compensation was offered by them.

I contacted some auction houses and many of them have a lifetime guarantee for their sales. At any time, even 20 years down the line, if a graded coin turns out not to be graded correctly, or if the graded coin turns out to be a fake, the buyer can return the coin and the sale will be reversed, and if you have already received the money for the consignment, you will have to pay it back to the auction house. Don't think that you will be able to get the grading companies to take responsibility for their mistake. They will ensure that they will not be held responsible using legal mumbo jumbo in their terms of use.

If its a large value item, it makes sense to hire a lawyer, but if its not a 20,000 dollar item or more, there really is no point in that since you will end up spending that in legal fees.

So be aware that there is a chance, however small, that the slabbed coin you have sold at an auction can be challenged and you will be on the hook for that forever.

Make sure you understand the rules of each auction house regarding returns before consigning to them.

*** Moved by Staff to a more appropriate forum. ***
Pillar of the Community
Learn More...
Pacificoin's Avatar
Canada
5391 Posts
 Posted 04/15/2024  12:55 pm  Show Profile   Check Pacificoin's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add Pacificoin to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
In this business your word is your bond .
Sorry but in my opinion you are ultimately
responsible. The coin wasn't what it was supposed to be
and the auction buyer returned it .
Best to just take your lumps , own it and move on .
Pillar of the Community
Learn More...
BStrauss3's Avatar
United States
4587 Posts
 Posted 04/15/2024  1:09 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add BStrauss3 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I think you are not a lawyer - I'm not either - and you are emotionally interpreting what is said, not what the laws of the several states say.

To understand what you agreed to, you need to get your hands on the consignment T&C you agreed to. You might find you retained title until the coins were delivered to the seller and that the auction house never "owned" them, simply acting as a facilitator.

If an auction house wishes to extend a lifetime guarantee, that may be between them and the purchaser. They cannot unilaterally make you a party to another contract. Emphasis on unilateral. What does your consignment T&C say?

The first thing you need to understand is the contract YOU have is with the auction house - that plus the laws of whatever state is identified in the contract are what controls.

For reference, the Uniform Commercial Code (https://www.law.cornell.edu/ucc/2) is a model law used as the basis for the laws of the various states. But every state (especially Louisianna) has its twists...

Auction houses don't make these terms & conditions easy to find, but when you do review them you will learn that you probably gave up the right to sue in favor of arbitration, and there is a specific set of laws, e.g. the laws of the state of Xyzzy.

Now these are the buyer's terms, but you'll get the idea...

Warning-To-Consigners-Of-Auctions.-In-Many-Cases,-Sales-Can-Be-Reversed-At-Any-Time.

Warning-To-Consigners-Of-Auctions.-In-Many-Cases,-Sales-Can-Be-Reversed-At-Any-Time.

Oh, and they might tell you it's a lifetime guarantee to the buyer, but the T&C says differently:

Warning-To-Consigners-Of-Auctions.-In-Many-Cases,-Sales-Can-Be-Reversed-At-Any-Time.

and

Warning-To-Consigners-Of-Auctions.-In-Many-Cases,-Sales-Can-Be-Reversed-At-Any-Time.

Warning-To-Consigners-Of-Auctions.-In-Many-Cases,-Sales-Can-Be-Reversed-At-Any-Time.

The large print giveth and the small print taketh away...



Your point is well said "Make sure you understand the rules of each auction house regarding returns before consigning to them." I'll expand it to saying make sure you understand the rules period.

Selling your precious coins is emotional, but more importantly contractual.
-----Burton
50+ year / Life / Emeritus ANA member (joined 12/1/1973)
Life member: Numismatics International, CONECA
Member: TNA, FtWCC, NETCC, EveryCountry (online) coin club
Owned by three cats and a wife of 40+ years (joined 1983)

Author: 3rd Edition of the Sample Slabs book, https://www.sampleslabs.info/
Bedrock of the Community
Earle42's Avatar
United States
10029 Posts
 Posted 04/15/2024  4:30 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Earle42 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Thanks for this info. Not surprised the grading companies duck out on this one. They keep themselves totally unaccountable and thus can do anything they want. Their guarantee is about useless to anyone but themselves. The exception is when they slab a fake as real, then they do take responsibility. But when you handle enough modern fakes they typically are not hard to tell just by appearance. Having the proper tools to verify a fake though mean they very, very rarely ever will make this mistake.

The auction house should have some sort of agreement pinning the grading companies down to being responsible. The buyer, seller, and auction house all thought the coin was what the label said. So the ones making the real mistake get off free.
How much squash could a Sasquatch squash if a Sasquatch would squash squash?
Download and read: Grading the graders
Costly TPG ineptitude and No FG Kennedy halves
https://ln5.sync.com/dl/7ca91bdd0/w...i3b-rbj9fir2
Valued Member
Canada
191 Posts
 Posted 04/15/2024  9:01 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add recollector to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
own it and move on .

so I should own pcgs and cac's mistake. got it.
Pillar of the Community
Learn More...
Pacificoin's Avatar
Canada
5391 Posts
 Posted 04/15/2024  9:06 pm  Show Profile   Check Pacificoin's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add Pacificoin to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Yes indeed you are the one who consigned the coin .
It was not what it was supposed to be .

Pillar of the Community
Learn More...
BStrauss3's Avatar
United States
4587 Posts
 Posted 04/16/2024  08:56 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add BStrauss3 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
The auction house should have some sort of agreement pinning the grading companies down to being responsible.


The auction house has no contractual relationship with the grading company when it comes to grading your coin. That was a contract between you and the grading company.

As I said above in the other context:


Quote:
They cannot unilaterally make you a party to another contract.


They could certainly contract between an auction house and a grading company to provide extra service(s) to their mutual customer, but who pays for that, and (honestly) what is in it for both parties...

-----Burton
50+ year / Life / Emeritus ANA member (joined 12/1/1973)
Life member: Numismatics International, CONECA
Member: TNA, FtWCC, NETCC, EveryCountry (online) coin club
Owned by three cats and a wife of 40+ years (joined 1983)

Author: 3rd Edition of the Sample Slabs book, https://www.sampleslabs.info/
  Previous TopicReplies: 6 / Views: 574Next Topic  

To participate in the forum you must log in or register.



    




Disclaimer: While a tremendous amount of effort goes into ensuring the accuracy of the information contained in this site, Coin Community assumes no liability for errors. Copyright 2005 - 2026 Coin Community Family- all rights reserved worldwide. Use of any images or content on this website without prior written permission of Coin Community or the original lender is strictly prohibited.
Contact Us  |  Advertise Here  |  Privacy Policy / Terms of Use

Coin Community Forum © 2005 - 2026 Coin Community Forums
It took 0.33 seconds to rattle this change. Forums