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Sept. Severus Emesa Mint AR Denarius Fortvna Redvci

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Valued Member

France
383 Posts
 Posted 08/04/2024  03:58 am Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add pastpost to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
Dear friends,
Please help me to attribute Sept. Severus Denarius.
Obverse: IMP CAE L SEP SEV PERT AVG COS II
Reverse: FORTVNA REDVCI
Fortuna, draped, standing left, holding rudder set on globe in right hand and cornucopiae in left hand
There is RIC IV Septimius Severus 385A with the same coin but it says that Fortuna (Pax) is seated!!! Not standing. https://numismatics.org/ocre/id/ric...385A?lang=en
May be it variation of RIC 385A?

Thanks in advance.

Sept.-Severus-Emesa-Mint-AR-Denarius-Fortvna-Redvci
Sept.-Severus-Emesa-Mint-AR-Denarius-Fortvna-Redvci
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Victor's Avatar
United States
900 Posts
 Posted 08/04/2024  10:01 am  Show Profile   Check Victor's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add Victor to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
That is just a typo, in RIC it has Fortuna (Pax) standing and if you look at the example on OCRE, it is standing also-- coin posted below.

Note that 385a is holding a branch though; not rudder like your coin.

Your coin is RIC IV Emesa 378

https://numismatics.org/ocre/id/ric....378?lang=en




Sept.-Severus-Emesa-Mint-AR-Denarius-Fortvna-Redvci
Edited by Victor
08/04/2024 10:06 am
Valued Member
France
383 Posts
 Posted 08/04/2024  10:22 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add pastpost to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
@Victor - Many thanks for your link.
But RIC IV Emesa 378 has Obverse
Legend: IMP CAE L SEP SEV PERT AVG II,
Reverse: FORTVNAE REDVCI.
And this coin reverse: FORTVNA REDVCI
And obverse: IMP CAE L SEP SEV PERT AVG COS II
They are differentin all.
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maridvnvm's Avatar
United Kingdom
2099 Posts
 Posted 08/04/2024  10:27 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add maridvnvm to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I hope that you don't mind but I will make this a quite full answer rather than the very short answer that I can give.

For those who don't want to read on then here is the short form version. I would attribute this as either RIC 377 var. or probably more correctly unlisted near RIC 377. The rationale for this is that the type takes precedence over legend in placing the coins in RIC.

It is a variation that I do not have in my own collection but will give you some context within which to place it.

The longest form of the legend in this series is FORTVNAE REDVCI with an exception in the II COS reverse sub-series where there is a "FORTVNAE REDVCI II COS" legend. It is my speculation that the legends shorten over time with the dominant form being FORTVN REDVC but being FORT REDVC at the shortest form. The legend is combined with a number of reverse deities in standing and seated forms.

Fortuna
Fortuna seated left, holding rudder and cornucopiae
Fortuna standing left, holding rudder and cornucopiae
Pax
Fortuna (pax?), with modius on head, seated left holding branch and cornucopia
Hilaritas
Fortuna (Hilaritas) standing left holding long palm and cornucopia
Fortuna (Hilaritas) seated left holding long palm and cornucopia
Pietas
Fortuna (Pietas) standing left holding patera and cornucopia, sacrificing over altar
?
Fortuna standing left, holding long sceptre & cornucopia
Exceptionally Moneta / Aequitas
Moneta/Aequitas standing left, holding scales in right hand, cornucopiae in left

RIC only notes one FORT... type in the earliest AVG issue, which is FORT REDVG, Hilaritas and cites Cohen 169. I have not been able to confirm this coin, the REDVG should certainly be REDVC. This short legend would be unusual in ths early issue.

I have a couple of examples from this AVG issue...

FORTVNAE REDVC, Fortuna seated left, holding rudder and cornucopiae
Sept.-Severus-Emesa-Mint-AR-Denarius-Fortvna-Redvci
FORTVNE (sic) RDVCI (sic), Fortuna standing left, holding rudder and cornucopiae
Sept.-Severus-Emesa-Mint-AR-Denarius-Fortvna-Redvci

The COS I issue is always problematic. There are regular mis-readings of COS I-I coins that have occured making me doubt so many of the coins in RIC. I can confirm that RIC Page 139 (5) does exist with the following coin being a double die match to the example in the BM, which is the coin cited in RIC

FORTVNAE REDVCI, Fortuna (Pietas) standing left holding patera and cornucopia, sacrificing over altar
Sept.-Severus-Emesa-Mint-AR-Denarius-Fortvna-Redvci

Amongst these two issues we get the odd obverse legend varieties, which certainly pre-date the much larger COS II issue.

II C - FORTVNAE REDVCI, Fortuna (Pax?) seated left holding branch and cornucopia
Sept.-Severus-Emesa-Mint-AR-Denarius-Fortvna-Redvci
II CO - FORTVNAE REDVCI, Fortuna (pax?), with modius on head, seated left holding branch and cornucopia
Sept.-Severus-Emesa-Mint-AR-Denarius-Fortvna-Redvci
II COS - FORTVNAE REDVCI II COS, Fortuna standing left holding rudder and cornucopia
ONLY 3 COINS KNOWN FROM THIS OBVERSE DIE
Sept.-Severus-Emesa-Mint-AR-Denarius-Fortvna-Redvci
II C - FORTVAE(sic) REDVCI, Moneta/Aequitas standing left, holding scales in right hand, cornucopiae in left
Sept.-Severus-Emesa-Mint-AR-Denarius-Fortvna-Redvci
. CO - FOTVNA-E (sic) R-EDVCI, Fortuna standing left, holding rudder in right hand, cornucopia in left
Sept.-Severus-Emesa-Mint-AR-Denarius-Fortvna-Redvci
II C - FORTVNAE REDVCI, Fortuna (Pax?) seated left holding branch and cornucopia
Sept.-Severus-Emesa-Mint-AR-Denarius-Fortvna-Redvci

The COS II has so many variants of type and legend that you would certainly give up looking before I posted most let alone all of mine (I have several dozen variations).

Here is a FORTVNA REDVCI, Pax type like the one you mention.

Sept.-Severus-Emesa-Mint-AR-Denarius-Fortvna-Redvci

and the longer FORTVNAE REDVCI
Sept.-Severus-Emesa-Mint-AR-Denarius-Fortvna-Redvci

Hilaritas standing and seated (very scarce)

FORTV-NA REDVCI
Sept.-Severus-Emesa-Mint-AR-Denarius-Fortvna-Redvci
FORTVN R-EDVC
Sept.-Severus-Emesa-Mint-AR-Denarius-Fortvna-Redvci

I would pleace you coin near this type, though likely chronologically slightly earlier
Sept.-Severus-Emesa-Mint-AR-Denarius-Fortvna-Redvci

Your coin is an obverse die match with the following coins, the first pair being a double die match with each other
Sept.-Severus-Emesa-Mint-AR-Denarius-Fortvna-Redvci
Sept.-Severus-Emesa-Mint-AR-Denarius-Fortvna-Redvci
Another obverse die match
Sept.-Severus-Emesa-Mint-AR-Denarius-Fortvna-Redvci

I think I have some other obverse die matches and have seen others..

In summary. A nice find and one I will make a note of for my records.
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Victor's Avatar
United States
900 Posts
 Posted 08/04/2024  10:42 am  Show Profile   Check Victor's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add Victor to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
sorry that I missed the legend difference.

I didn't see an example on Barry Murphy's page

https://bpmurphy.ancients.info/seve...eranhome.htm
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maridvnvm's Avatar
United Kingdom
2099 Posts
 Posted 08/04/2024  10:58 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add maridvnvm to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I suspect that RIC 378 is AVG II C....
Valued Member
France
383 Posts
 Posted 08/04/2024  12:19 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add pastpost to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
@maridvnvm - I know that you are great expert in Emesa mint. Many thanks for your reply and your coins are great.
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maridvnvm's Avatar
United Kingdom
2099 Posts
 Posted 08/04/2024  2:15 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add maridvnvm to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The OCRE RIC 378 is a mis-attributed AVG . CO. Same obverse die as the following coin.

Sept.-Severus-Emesa-Mint-AR-Denarius-Fortvna-Redvci
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