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1941 LWC Ragged Clip And Huge Lamination Error On Reverse!

 
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 Posted 09/16/2019  04:40 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add John1 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Thank you spruett001.
John1
( I'm no pro, it's just my humble opinion )
Searched 5+ Million Cents Since 1971
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 Posted 09/16/2019  05:06 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Petespockets55 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Wouldn't the weight help with an answer, as large as the depression is?

Underweight and this would be peeled lamination (delamination).
Overweight (or close to normal) and it would be a struck through.

I've considered these to be peeled lamination based on the "rumpled" floor of the depression as well as the outline of the remaining metal through the N of CENT. But a struck through "copper fragment" that bonded with the planchet might produce the same effects, which is why the weight is important IMHO.
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 Posted 09/16/2019  10:49 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Sarge50 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Will get a weight ASAP.....be advised there is a portion of the coin missing from a suspected ragged clip so that will effect weight! Stand by for weight.......
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 Posted 09/17/2019  03:16 am  Show Profile   Check spruett001's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add spruett001 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
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 Posted 09/17/2019  04:18 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add John1 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Sitting and waiting now
John1
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 Posted 09/17/2019  11:28 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Sarge50 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Coin weight was 2.97! Thanks all for your determination if it's a
DELAM/LAM or Strike through with ragged clip?

So could the piece missing from the clip weigh .14?
Edited by Sarge50
09/17/2019 11:45 am
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 Posted 09/17/2019  12:53 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Sarge50 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply



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 Posted 09/17/2019  1:43 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add stoneman227 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Sarge. There are three dies used to produce a coin. The hammer die , the anvil die and the collar.
The hammer die forces the planchet against and into the anvil die which produces the outward flow of coin metal that the collar contains to form the edge. One of the ways to attribute damage to a coin is to ask yourself if there is coin metal protruding into a area where the die would not have let it go. The anomaly on the edge of the coin is damage because it showes metal forced above the plane of the coins field that the die would not have allowed at the time of strike.
The weight of the coin is luckily not needed in this instance to prove a delamination issue as missing metal at the edge complicates the matter. The lines that run parallel to the missing metal in the lam are an indication of the poor mixture of metals that composed the planchet. They are toned parts of the original planchet and would not be the result of a strike through. That they run perpendicular to the striations in the lam is to be expected and reinforce the attribution of delamination.
Edited by stoneman227
09/17/2019 1:45 pm
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 Posted 09/17/2019  1:58 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Sarge50 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
stoneman227.......I so much appreciate your expert analysis but I was asked to weigh it and post that data and I did that even though I to thought It would weigh less with the clip piece missing and thought that would definitely make it weigh underweight! I think I read you do not think it is a strike through but more likely a de-lamination Error even though their is no damage to the obverse? I did not know there were 3 dies involved that are used to make a coin, thank for the information I am absorbing like a sponge! Lastly, is their a demand for delamination coins or are their collectors of such errors?
Edited by Sarge50
09/17/2019 5:05 pm
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 Posted 09/17/2019  7:57 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Petespockets55 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Thanks Sarge for weighing the coin and Stoneman for that clear analysis.

The lighter weight adds more evidence to it being a lamination for those that were in the struck through camp.
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 Posted 09/17/2019  8:46 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add stoneman227 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Sarge , damage doesn't necessarily have to be present ( and more often than not it isn't)for a coin to delaminate.
A nice unusual lam can tickle the fancy of error collectors and bring a premium.
This split before strike cent and the split after strike Buffalo nickel beside it are examples that would bring a premium.

This cent lam and its bark would bring a premium together


Unusual pieces always garner interest

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 Posted 09/18/2019  11:37 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add coop to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Was the weight normal? If so, I see a folded piece of debris struck on the reverse. If it is a bit under, then a split off debris with on rim and a peeled off folded debris issue. Laminations are often un mixed debris rolled on to the stock material. After the blanks are cut, the upset process loosens the rolled in debris and after striking, it falls off the coin. This looks like it happened to this coin with also a folded over struck through debris that also fell off the coin. If the weight is normal, then the break away on the rim, was struck back on to the coin. If a bit light then the coin is two errors as I mentioned. The debris could also be a folded piece of cardboard? But weight would tell us more.
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 Posted 09/18/2019  8:25 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Petespockets55 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Sarge said the weight was 2.97 grams.
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 Posted 09/18/2019  8:35 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add coop to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Sounds like the suggestion I made. Struck through a debris item and lamination on the edge. Both peeled off after the strike. looking at the edge again, I noticed the edge looks like damage because the metal was pushed aside. So you do have a struck through debris error on the coin. (I ruled out lamination, because no ghost devices appear on that area, also the fold over area on the lower part.
Richard S. Cooper
Some have asked about my images I use and I'm glad to say, you can now you can see the DVD in sections on youtube:
1. Intro, older coins, toned coins 2. Doubled dies 3. Die events, One of a kind errors 4. So called errors, Coin information 5. Coin information Types and Varieties, Overlays
Jefferson nickel doubled dies Wexler/Rebar complete listings

trail dies:http://www.traildies.com/
Edited by coop
09/19/2019 01:20 am
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 Posted 09/18/2019  10:14 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add stoneman227 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I guess that I'll politely disagree and just leave it at that.
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