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Help Needed: Underweight German Thaler (Frankfurt)

 
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Author Previous TopicReplies: 11 / Views: 619Next Topic  
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Australia
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 Posted 08/06/2021  08:41 am Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add nodlib to your friends list Get a Link to this Message
Hi,

Viewing this 1620 Frankfurt thaler, which is underweight at 25.9gs when this type is normally around 28gs. It is from a PCGS certified dealer in Germany. Could this coin be genuine, or does it being underweight prove it is a cast or some other forgery? Cost: 75 euro.

Many thanks for your insight.

Edited by nodlib
08/06/2021 08:43 am
Valued Member
497 Posts
 Posted 08/06/2021  08:48 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Numister to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Personally I find the 'wrinkles' and 'porous-ness' in certain portions concerning. But not entirely familiar with this type of coins maybe they were all made like that.

Just saying in general if I see coins like that, I tend to stay clear of them.
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United States
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 Posted 08/06/2021  08:48 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add John1 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
( I'm no pro, it's just my humble opinion )
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 Posted 08/06/2021  09:10 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add tdziemia to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I can't find an exact match for this coin on asearch (lettering and punctuation on the cross side), but apparently there are many varieties (maybe someone with Davenport catalog can comment).

In your first photo, the coin seems out of round, and it looks like maybe a mount has been removed at about 6:00. If there were metal removed as a result (filing, etc to repair it), that could account for some weight difference, but 2 g. seems like a big difference. What does the dealer say about it?

Edit: I just saw this one, also underweight, possibly a die match to yours: https://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotv...94e917243836

I'm not sure that's good news.

Edited by tdziemia
08/06/2021 09:20 am
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 Posted 08/06/2021  09:14 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add t360 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Three red flags - underweight, underpriced, and doesn't look quite right. The dealer would be asking about 300 euros if it were authentic.
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 Posted 08/06/2021  09:22 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add tdziemia to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
@t360, I just edited my earlier post. I found a die match on another underweight example.

Probably the biggest red flag of all.
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 Posted 08/06/2021  09:44 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add t360 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
In the dealer's description, "Stark Untergewichtig" (severely underweight) combined with the low price tells me he is not confident that it is genuine.
Edited by t360
08/06/2021 11:14 am
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 Posted 08/06/2021  10:19 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Numister to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Seems like more red flags than a Nuremberg rally
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 Posted 08/06/2021  4:12 pm  Show Profile   Check Pacificoin's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add Pacificoin to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Does not look right , typical Chinese Counterfeit cast grey colouration look .
Not even close to proper weight tolerance .
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 Posted 08/06/2021  11:04 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add newguy22 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I personally avoid underweight coins fearing them to be counterfeit
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Australia
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 Posted 08/07/2021  6:55 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add nodlib to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Thanks for your insight, everyone! I'll steer clear of this coin given its suspect nature.
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