based on these photos the light hairlines on the cheek are not going to change the grade on this coin. the coin has seen only very minor circulation. nice high end AU58 coin. i'd say choice for the grade
It seems like too low a grade for a coin that is actually uncirculated - I personally sense a bit of wear, but I don't see the kind of surface marks normally associated with MS-61.
Quote: I'm wondering if hairlines on the obverse could affect its grade if it got crossed over to PCGS/ NGC? What is the "acceptable amount" of hairlines on a coin so that it could still get a straight grade?
Hairlines could get the coin a cleaned or scratched designation on the holder, having it without a straight grade labeled as a "problem" coin. There isn't an exact amount of hairlines that can bring it in a details holder, it all depends on the coin and the mood of the grader. Grading is subjective after all.
I believe the coin is AU-58 Dipped. No toning left and there is minor rub. MS-61 is too high for a coin with this wear. A 61 usually has virtually no wear and a lot of contact marks. On a proof, it could be a small problem like minor hairlines. This coin exhibits obvious wear, having it at most an AU-58 in my book.
Quote: I believe the coin is AU-58 Dipped. No toning left and there is minor rub. MS-61 is too high for a coin with this wear. A 61 usually has virtually no wear and a lot of contact marks. On a proof, it could be a small problem like minor hairlines. This coin exhibits obvious wear, having it at most an AU-58 in my book.
I think the coin might have been lightly cleaned a while ago (I hope not!). If it was dipped, would both sides of the coin exhibit the same amount of luster and the carbon spot on the reverse should have gone away? This is the video showing the luster of the coin. You can see that the reverse is more lustrous than the obverse.
i agree with coinfrog that if the grader did not see any signs of circulation on this coin MS61 is the wrong grade. the coin should have graded MS63 imo.
side note: i'd rather have a really choice AU58 coin than a crappy MS63 any day.
Quote: i agree with coinfrog that if the grader did not see any signs of circulation on this coin MS61 is the wrong grade. the coin should have graded MS63 imo.
Do you think the lack of luster (lack of eye appeal) could knock down the coin's grade?
Quote: Do you think the lack of luster (lack of eye appeal) could knock down the coin's grade?
there are some dull areas but you will see this on MS63 coins. the obv looks to have at least 50% remaining and the reverse about 80%. this is not going to knock this coin 2 points. the coin has eye appeal. sometimes they just dont get it right
Quote: there are some dull areas but you will see this on MS63 coins. the obv looks to have at least 50% remaining and the reverse about 80%. this is not going to knock this coin 2 points. the coin has eye appeal. sometimes they just dont get it right
Thank you for your feedback. It is indeed a nice coin that I won from an eBay auction last week. I didn't regret pruchasing it as the price was reasonable.
Nice variety. Have sent about 105 barber half's quarters and dimes into ANACS last 5 months and the high grade ones have me batting around .200 ANACS graders imo cut a little more elbow room (but not much) their graders are no dummies and they are # 3 of the big 3 so lets not kid anyone and say their no good...going out on a limb but these shiny reverse sorts kinda shiny obverse barbers 90% of the time come back "details cleaned" so looks like your coin might have caused a harder look and it passed. MS-61 is a wilcard grade a crazy grade and I love them especially in the old soapboxes but the modern ones are iffy to me. I figure your coin is an excellent AU-58 NGC and an excellent MS-61 ANACS its a cool variety and is market acceptable. Nice pick up, I have a couple that look identical to your example and they say "cleaned" I stomped and said crap! LOL glad you like your new pickup great topic.
Quote: Nice pick up, I have a couple that look identical to your example and they say "cleaned" I stomped and said crap! LOL glad you like your new pickup great topic.
There seem to be four things going on here. First, there is the cheek rash, which looks more like bagginess than circulation. Second, there does seem to be an old cleaning, which ANACS evidently sees as market acceptable. Third, there is the difference in obverse and reverse luster, which could be different retoning during album storage. Fourth, like the others on this board, I'm at a tossup between slider and BU. The 61 sure seems like a net grade, trying to balance those considerations.
I agree, leave it in the ANACS slab. The 61 is a good argument against people who see it as a slider, and it may attract people who want to risk cracking it and rolling the dice at the TPG casino.
Great variety, and a nice coin. Thanks for sharing it with us!
Quote: If it was dipped, would both sides of the coin exhibit the same amount of luster and the carbon spot on the reverse should have gone away?
Not exactly. The reverse design helps maintain the luster in the fields, while Miss Liberty's cheeks is a canvas for wear and distracting marks. Even in lower AU grades, the reverse can look fantastic and lusterous on this barber type.
Carbon spots can have deep toning into the coin. Deep toning can only be removed with a very long dip, which damages the entire coin. I assume this was a very fast dip, taking away any minor surface toning while leaving the deep spots present.
I liked the videos, they showed the coin from a different perspective. It is now hard to say UNC or AU slider, but I'll take the safe route and stick with my AU-58.
Quote: First, there is the cheek rash, which looks more like bagginess than circulation. Second, there does seem to be an old cleaning, which ANACS evidently sees as market acceptable.
Thank you fortcollins for your input. After looking the coin over a jewelry loupe, I can tell that the coin has a lot of hairlines but I can see them moving when rotating the coin under the light. Attached photos show the hairlines under different angles. I tried my best to show how "bad" the coin can appear under the loupe. Is this a normal thing for a coin with this grade? (I'm aware that MS60-61-62 can be the grades for "problem" coins but I'm not really familiar with Barber coinage).
Again, I thank you for everyone's input/ comment. Even if I have had a lot of questions in my mind, everyone is helpful and answer my questions thoroughly. I have learnt a lot of new things in the community.
There should be also some hairlines just between the eagle neck and the left wings but my camera and the loupe cannot capture it. It can only be seen in person, unfortunately. (The hairlines shadow is from the slab itself.
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Posted 05/10/2022 08:24 am
