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Is ANA A Reputable Legit Grading Company And Request Opinion Of Grade On 1895 Indian Head Cent

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 Posted 12/10/2022  09:06 am Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add divesww to your friends list Get a Link to this Message
I purchased the pictured 1895 Indisn Head coin as being an ANACS graded MS 63 but upon receiving the slab I saw that it says it is actually graded by ANA. I read that they are an organization that uses NGC to do their grading. This is an older slab and could have been graded before ANA started using NGC. Does anyone know if this is a legitimate slab and whether ANA was a reputable first class grading organization? Also, I would like your opinions as to the grade of the coin. Thanks.




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 Posted 12/10/2022  09:20 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Coinfrog to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Pics are frankly too dark to see the coin's surface details clearly.



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 Posted 12/10/2022  09:26 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add panzaldi to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
the shadows are tough. the coin is inset in the holder which makes photos a little more of a challenge. I think you need lighting from two sources to offset the shadowing. coin however looks correctly graded based on what I can see.

I'm not familiar with ANA so cant comment on that
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 Posted 12/10/2022  09:29 am  Show Profile   Check CarrsCoins's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add CarrsCoins to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
ANA doesn't use anyone to do their grading. they are a coin club. they are sometimes affiliated with a grading company in the way a beer company is sometimes affiliated with a football team.

ANACS was the first grading company and worked heavily with the ANA in the early days. they had some really bad years in the middle and now they are back to being a respected grading company. during the less consistent years they lost their ANA affiliation. you can read about their fall from grace and peoples thoughts on the company here: http://goccf.com/t/434289

your slab is really early ANACS. I think this is the type of holder that is often called a soapbox. the plastic is worth a premium on your coin. I'mánot up to date on that market so I'mánot sure what kind of premium though.
I collect low grade large cents. I currently have >230 Sheldon varieties and >235 middle date Newcomb varieties.
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 Posted 12/10/2022  10:51 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add BStrauss3 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
CarrsCoins you are wrong.

ANACS was founded by and part of the ANA until late 1990 when it was sold to Amos Press.

Coins were initially just authenticated and then photocerts with grades were issued, ANACS began encapsulating coins using the soapbox holder in 1989. Those are the coins with the blue "Official ANA Grade".

With the rise of PCGS and NGC, ANA would have had to invest substantially to keep ANACS going. As a federally chartered educational society, ANA would have been hard-pressed to justify the investment. Hence the sale to a private entity.

After the sale, Amos began using the green underprint labels. After a couple of years they stopped using the two-letter, four-digit cert#s from the ANA days and began using all numeric certs.
-----Burton
49 year / Life ANA member (joined 12/1/1973)
Life member: Numismatics International, CONECA
Member: TNA, FtWCC, NETCC, OnLine Coin Club
Owned by four cats and a wife of 39 years (joined 1983)

PS: ANA's records are messed up, they show me as a 50-year member and I'm now Emeritus
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 Posted 12/10/2022  10:55 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add BStrauss3 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Being the official ANA grading service after the sale to Amos Press is a paid-for relationship.

ANACS grades under ANA ownership reflect the highly technical grades of the era following the ANA Grading Standards.

Under ownership by Amos Press and later by Anderson Press, they moved to more market-based grading which was the standards of PCGS and NGC.

There isn't an exact 1:1 relationship between the ANACS-ANA grades and today's grades. Many coins are undergraded, but there are also coins in those holders that are overgraded - BY TODAY'S STANDARDS. Might technically be MS63, but it's an UGLY MS63 and it gets an MS62 grade today.

-----Burton
49 year / Life ANA member (joined 12/1/1973)
Life member: Numismatics International, CONECA
Member: TNA, FtWCC, NETCC, OnLine Coin Club
Owned by four cats and a wife of 39 years (joined 1983)

PS: ANA's records are messed up, they show me as a 50-year member and I'm now Emeritus
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 Posted 12/10/2022  2:07 pm  Show Profile   Check CarrsCoins's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add CarrsCoins to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
thanks for clarifying that bstrauss3. you have a lot of good points to add about anacs history.

perhaps my wording was unclear. ill try to clarity - what I was trying to convey is that ANA doesn't use anyone to do their grading because they are a coin club. they dont have grading that needs to be done. they arent resellers. they dont grade coins. the coins they display at their museum arent slabbed (usually). the coins they use for education can be slabbed by any company or none at all. ngc currently has an affiliation with them which they pay for. that relationship is advertising. as a subsidiary of the ANA they worked heavily with the ANA proper in their infancy. ANACS had a relationship with the ANA. they lost that affiliation.
I collect low grade large cents. I currently have >230 Sheldon varieties and >235 middle date Newcomb varieties.
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 Posted 12/10/2022  5:05 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add paralyse to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I would agree with 63RB. Perhaps even 64RB.

I have a few coins in the old small ANA holders (they are quite collectible in and of themselves and will bring premiums irrespective of the coin inside) and have found them to be accurately graded for the most part, or slightly under modern market grades.

The early ANA/ANACS small white holders were not well sealed, though, and coins inside can sometimes tone in less than desirable ways. The last series of ANACS small white holders (before the change to the modern large-size slabs) don't seem to have that issue as often.

The ANA / ANACS / NCI Photo Certificate coins are also very collectible, and they were still using the American Numismatic Association branding and logos back then as well.

In my opinion it is not a good idea for the company that literally wrote the book on modern grading standards to have a vested ownership interest in the certification and grading process, and that is probably at least one reason why the ANA now only has an advertising relationship/agreement with NGC.
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 Posted 12/10/2022  5:12 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add numismatic student to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I also think it looks better than 63rb. Nice coin!
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 Posted 12/10/2022  6:29 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Slider23 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Here is information about your slab: ANACS Slab Generation 1

Produced from Feb 1989 - Jun 1990. It is ANACS' 11th Generation of certification following the 10 generations of Photo Certificates. This holder is the 1st generation slab style holder issued by the ANA prior to being purchased by Amos Publishing and being re-labeled ANACS.

The slab is uncommon and it is a keeper.


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 Posted 12/10/2022  6:36 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add jimbucks to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Coins in these slabs are generally properly graded. I wouldn't worry about it, in fact, many are conservative and may grade higher by today's standards. Let me add - toning appears stable after all these years, and coin looks as if it could grade MS-64 or higher. If offered at auction as is, it should bring a premium.
Edited by jimbucks
12/10/2022 6:46 pm
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 Posted 12/10/2022  6:42 pm  Show Profile   Check BH1964's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add BH1964 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
That's ANACS and yes, completely legit. Beautiful coin in an old holder.
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 Posted 12/10/2022  9:30 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add JTCC to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I agree, legitimate grader, nice coin.
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 Posted 12/10/2022  11:24 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add NumismaticsFTW to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
No need for better pictures at all.

Those slabs are easily recognizable and they are highly sought after and bring premiums.

They are legit, respectable and known for having a conservative grade.
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Edited by NumismaticsFTW
12/10/2022 11:30 pm
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 Posted 12/11/2022  06:44 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add nickelsearcher to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
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Nice looking coin.
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 Posted 12/11/2022  07:44 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add MisterT to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Grading will always be subjective even amongst TPG's. 63RB seems correct to me.
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