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Grading Companies Which Sell Their Own Slabs

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Valued Member
United States
344 Posts
 Posted 11/19/2006  09:15 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add mishap-coins to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT <http://www.asa-accugrade.com/lawsui...aint.php>
ACG has been incorporated and engaged in the rare coin grading, certification and ... d; Bob Johnson d/b/a Centsless;. e. Sal Fusco d/b/a NCA; ... https://www.asa-accugrade.com/lawsu...omplaint.php - 65k - Nov 17, 2006 -
The 2 links below shows there is someone out there trying to stop this madness !
http://www.coinlink.com/2005/pr/nca_0912.html
http://www.stopcoinfraud.org/press.html




Tell me more about what you found regarding NNC http://www.nnccoingrading.com/ I have NNC's domain information (Bob Johnson and James Little), but couldn't match an eBay username with either registrant although both Florida and Ohio seller locations are prominant among NNC sales. There were just too many other NNC sellers with FL and OH addresses, almost as if NNC were a neighborhood business.

Fred
[/quote]


Fred, It appears that this company states they do not sale their own coins, so if anyone caught them selling their own coins then they would be subject to broken laws . Looks like they may have indeed put disclosures in to protect themselves. Seems it is always in the wording. Read before one buys.

NNC is a limited liability company which probably could be a name that could be seating in a cabinet possibly in an unscrupulous attorneys office in a 6 X 6 room with a phone at a dead end street.
Below are quotes from their website.

Subjectivity Of Grading

Limitation of Liability for Grading: All parties understand and agree that the professional opinion required in grading coins involves NNC's subjective judgment. Consequently, National Numismatic Certification, LLC. makes no warranty or representation and shall have no liability whatsoever to the customer for the grade assigned by NNC to any coin.
NNC is an independent third-party coin grading service which does not buy or sell coins, nor does NNC appraise coins in terms of monetary value. National Numismatic Certification, LLC. cannot guarantee the liquidity of any coin graded by NNC. NNC certification of a particular coin cannot provide protection from the risks inherent in any market for such coins, if such a market exists

The part that is interesting to me and I can't mention any names though there are some that work or have worked for legite grading groups that they themselves continue to sell an over abundant amount of coins slabbed by these companies they are or were affiliated with. Not that is is not legal though I believe it is unethically correct. And we all know there is alot of back scratching going on within the industry and if the whole truth were known about alot of things in this industry it would then have it turned upside down..
Edited by mishap-coins
11/19/2006 10:49 am
Rest in Peace
United States
2684 Posts
 Posted 11/19/2006  11:15 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Morgan Fred to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
MC, you stated a truism when you said "it's always in the wording". These unrated boiler room grading companies always seem to go into great depth describing the subjective nature of coin grading, but they NEVER state which standards they use to grade coins, e.g., Photograde, ANA, etc. It is these standards and the consistency and strictness to which they are applied which separate the quality grading services from the wannabes, self-servers, and fraudsters.

Fred
Rest in Peace
United States
2684 Posts
 Posted 11/19/2006  11:21 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Morgan Fred to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I just quickly reviewed the articles describing the efforts of Numismatic Consumers Alliance. This organization needs more national attention among coin collectors. It seems well-funded, professionally run by persons with expertise in the pursuit of fraud, and thus appears to be effective. Now, if we only had a couple dozen more just like them.

Fred

Valued Member
United States
344 Posts
 Posted 11/19/2006  12:03 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add mishap-coins to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
You are right Fred,

Hopefully more efforts will be involved in helping protect our rights in this world of coin collecting.

Sad part is it all about money.

It seems like the guy down the road has a tire shop and on Friday nights he puts out nails..
Or the software company which sells software that stops and destroys a virus and on friday nights turns around and sends out thousands of trojan viruses.
Or the coin dealer that grades his own coins and encapsulates them for sell on friday nights but would never buy one of his own graded coins.

IT ALL BOILS DOWN TO MONEY and MONEY ONLY.

What it must look like to a new person getting into this arena of coin collecting. With all the forces of money vultures waiting to pray on the new person because they have a lack of education in the field of coin collecting.
Guess the best is start collecting 5 new rolls of each denomiation of each year forward from the bank and just put them away. If someone started at 10 years old by the time one was thirty or forty there is no telling what the value would be worth. Besides what you have invested is what you know it is worth. Forget about all the hooplay with TPG's and fraudsters etc.

All this below and it doesn't even begin to cover the amount of time being invested !
Coin Books
Coin Magazines
Coin Holders
Coin Boxes for Coin Holders
Coin Albums
Coin Club Dues
Membership Dues to submit coins to TPG
TPG fees
DSL or other online Service
Computer
Photo Equipment
Ebay Acct. or other auction fees to buy or sell Etc.
Graded on Non Graded Coins (Are they legite or not)

The list goes on and on and on and on and on.
Valued Member
United States
344 Posts
 Posted 11/19/2006  12:15 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add mishap-coins to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Heres a new one GEC grading company

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dl...=mem_guide:5
Rest in Peace
United States
2684 Posts
 Posted 11/19/2006  2:20 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Morgan Fred to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Yeah, I noticed him yesterday with my daily Morgan MS-67 eBay notice emails; the numbers of "MS-67" suddenly went up to 178 from its usual 10 or so from the other single-person boiler room slabbers. Almost all were GEC slabs (it's a miracle! He found a cache of pristine Morgans! ) The seller, sullyscoins has HUNDREDS of GEC slabs, so it's safe to presume he's slabbing his own coins and trying to peddle them. There ain't no way the "company" has been in business long enough for a single collector to accumulate all these slabs. The GEC website http://www.gecgrading.com/ gives only a contact email address with no other pertinent information. The domain gecgrading.com is registered to a proxy (blind) company in Scottsdale, AZ at which I've found a number of "grading company" domain registrations in which the owner does not want his/her actual ownership revealed.

Sometimes I think China has the right idea (a very permanent solution albeit a little extreme) with a bullet in the back of the head of fraudsters.

Fred
Pillar of the Community
Belgium
2078 Posts
 Posted 11/19/2006  4:39 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add ageka to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
can we not be civilised and just use the guilotine
Moderator
Learn More...
United States
23522 Posts
 Posted 11/19/2006  4:57 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add SsuperDdave to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The person I mentioned earlier in conjunction with NNC has been removed from the NNC Registry Whois, as of Nov. 2nd.
Valued Member
United States
344 Posts
 Posted 11/20/2006  10:45 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add mishap-coins to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I see GEC Grading sells starter kits to become your own grading service, atleast it looks that way.

http://www.mycertifiedcoins.com/


Certified Silver.Com, LLC another limited liability Company

http://www.mycertifiedcoins.com/BUY...HOLDERS.html
We will show you how to put your own label in the holders and start your own coin certification business. to get started contact us at the email listed below: sales@mycertifiedcoins.com



They will grade your coin for only $3.75 . http://csigrading.com/BUY_COIN_HOLDERS_NOW_.html

Looks like they may of been or know those with the CSI Grading Company!

Is amazing though it looks legal except the words buyer beware isn't added!! Company is close to vegas so it figures !
Valued Member
United States
344 Posts
 Posted 11/20/2006  11:35 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add mishap-coins to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Fred

They will help you start your own coin grading buisness. Very interesting .

My question is why would ANA have them as members?

Gec has led me to this company Certified Silver LLC which states=== We are a respected Member of the Americian Numismatic Association.


https://www.certifiedsilver.com/
Rest in Peace
United States
2684 Posts
 Posted 11/20/2006  11:59 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Morgan Fred to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
MC, I think it's because nobody has reported him to the ANA. He has also gone to a fair amount of effort to keep his identity hidden including having a proxy registration for his domain and using only his first name "Charlie" for his email address. If I get a chance, I'll send in the information to the ANA and they can take it from there. I don't think the ANA would appreciate its name being used in a promotion such as this.

Fred
Rest in Peace
United States
2684 Posts
 Posted 11/20/2006  12:14 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Morgan Fred to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Duly reported to Susan McMillan, Consumer Protection at ANA. I decided I better do it now or it would get buried on my To Do list.

Fred
Rest in Peace
United States
2684 Posts
 Posted 11/20/2006  2:35 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Morgan Fred to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Just got a message back from Susan McMillan at the ANA. She identified "Charlie" as Charles E. Milder of New Tripoli, PA as the owner of CertifiedSilver.com and sent him a message advising him he must use his full name and ANA membership number if he is going to use the ANA logo on his website. She gave him a week to comply. I don't know what happens to him if he doesn't comply; bullet or guillotine?

Fast service and response by the ANA!

Fred
Valued Member
United States
322 Posts
 Posted 11/20/2006  6:21 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add sandpaper to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Both and make it a TV show. Maybe call it Nic/cut
Valued Member
United States
152 Posts
 Posted 11/20/2006  7:07 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Sheepy to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I found "here" by typing in Hallmark Coin Grading... of course that was after a moment of weakness when I got in a bidding war on ebay over a Barber quarter. Immediately feeling buyer's remorse I did a search and found their website and your discussion... sigh... I have already paid, so I quess I'll wait and see what comes... sigh... I am feeling stupid!
Sheepy
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