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1881 S Morgan Dollar

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Coincarrie's Avatar
United States
25 Posts
 Posted 11/19/2011  10:33 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add Coincarrie to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
Ok, this is my first topic, question and forum experience ever, so please forgive any improprieties.

Hopefully, you see my 1881 S Morgan dollar. I know this is a MS coin. However, does anyone see any other characteristics unique to this coin.

(I have a few more of these too.)



1881-S-Morgan-Dollar

1881-S-Morgan-Dollar

1881-S-Morgan-Dollar
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ilikeikes's Avatar
United States
1205 Posts
 Posted 11/19/2011  10:46 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add ilikeikes to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Rotated die, CCW, unless YOU did that on the shoot....
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Bryan1315's Avatar
United States
14454 Posts
 Posted 11/20/2011  12:42 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Bryan1315 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
first to the forum. I do not know much about 1881-S Morgan VAM's but if you happen to see anything with the coin in hand that you think is interesting like doubling on some letters or something you can go to vamworld.com and see if anything there matches up with your coin. I do not know of any high value 1881-S VAM's but its always interesting to find them anyway just to expand your knowledge
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Coincarrie's Avatar
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 Posted 11/20/2011  10:45 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Coincarrie to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Thank you.

I am going to look up "Rotated die" and "CCW."

I like the joke about the kid swallowing change.
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Coincarrie's Avatar
United States
25 Posts
 Posted 11/20/2011  11:21 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Coincarrie to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Ilikeikes, Are you referring the reverse where it says "States?"
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Coincarrie's Avatar
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25 Posts
 Posted 11/20/2011  11:27 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Coincarrie to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
There does seem to be a 'ghost' mark above the letters in "state." As I turn the coin and adjust the degrees of rotation in the light, the other letters never adopt this look and the letters in "state" retain the same 'ghost.' Still, I looked up known rotations on Morgans and no one mentions this year and mint.

Perhaps I will take it to my coin dealer in Couer d'Alene and ask him if he thinks this is a rotation.
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Coincarrie's Avatar
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 Posted 11/20/2011  11:27 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Coincarrie to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
There does seem to be a 'ghost' mark above the letters in "state." As I turn the coin and adjust the degrees of rotation in the light, the other letters never adopt this look and the letters in "state" retain the same 'ghost.' Still, I looked up known rotations on Morgans and no one mentions this year and mint.

Perhaps I will take it to my coin dealer in Couer d'Alene and ask him if he thinks this is a rotation.
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SsuperDdave's Avatar
United States
23522 Posts
 Posted 11/20/2011  1:25 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add SsuperDdave to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
It's easy, Coincarrie - with the coin's obverse oriented straight up and down (date at the very bottom), flip it along the horizontal axis (between 9:00-3:00) without rotating it. "In God we trust" should be horizontal. If it isn't horizontal, the die is rotated.

The "shadowing" you see above STATES is a function of the toning the coin has in that area. The pressure of striking a coin literally alters the characteristics of the metal on its' surface, and the area to the outside (nearer the rim) of letters and numbers changes such that it doesn't acquire toning as easily as the rest, just like the surfaces of the letters/numbers themselves. This can be commonly seen on Morgans, and indicates that the toning you see is natural rather than artificial.
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Coincarrie's Avatar
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 Posted 11/20/2011  4:31 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Coincarrie to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I see. Thank you.

It could be rotated. I think it is. Seems to be swinging upward from left to right.
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SsuperDdave's Avatar
United States
23522 Posts
 Posted 11/20/2011  4:40 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add SsuperDdave to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Minor rotation is interesting, but fairly common with Morgans and not a value-added thing until it approaches 90 degrees.

This is a nice coin, displaying the excellent strike we would expect from 1881-S. They're available in extremely high grades, though, and yours would probably grade a good MS64 with a shot at 65. The reverse is excellent, and the obverse shows very little excepting a few marks on the cheek. That, unfortunately, is the most critical location on a Morgan for grading purposes, which is why I hesitate to call it 65. But for the cheek, I'd seriously think MS66 territory for this one.
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Coincarrie's Avatar
United States
25 Posts
 Posted 11/22/2011  1:15 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Coincarrie to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Thanks SuperDave!
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southsav's Avatar
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 Posted 11/22/2011  4:20 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add southsav to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
to CCF
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aladinslamp's Avatar
United States
3076 Posts
 Posted 11/23/2011  11:13 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add aladinslamp to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I can agree with Dave on your coin, its got some delicious appearances, but with the cheek its at MS64, even though it appears to be a very minor brush its in the Primary focal point which will keep it out of the MS65 range..as far as the die rotation goes, as stated above, it must be over 15 degree's in general to be thought of a rotated coin, however it interesting to note, many a CLASHED coin, has some form of rotation , usually from 2 to 7 degrees rotation, which gives us many of the known VAM varieties of letter transfer.....
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