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Are Coin Shows Getting Crazy

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Pillar of the Community
United States
1554 Posts
 Posted 01/19/2012  7:00 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add 1893S to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
DVC, What you are thinking may or may not be true in regards to the future. I am speaking about the here and now of things. But, I do see the younger collectors and dealers starting to get their feet wet. Three of the dealers I regularily purchase from are in their 30's, one is in his late 40's. And they are doing well. Two work the coin show circuit, one works for a large wholesaler, and the other owns a "brick and mortar that is going "gangbusters". ...Yes some of the old timers are starting to get out of the business but they are selling to younger upstarts and I beleive this will continue. That market that quickly gets flooded will be bought up by others and quite quickly I predict....Just my two or Three Cents worth...
Pillar of the Community
United States
1554 Posts
 Posted 01/19/2012  7:19 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add 1893S to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Also...I'm a "baby boomer" and Yes, there are alot more of us than younger collectors but for now we are buying and selling more than ever. I think we'll still be good to go for another 10 years anyway. I don't think serious collecting with large sums of money has ever been a young mans game...Whatever happens after us who knows, but, I think it will continue as strong as ever.
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GR58's Avatar
United States
11951 Posts
 Posted 01/19/2012  8:18 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add GR58 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
There are a lot of interesting post/ideas ..........
I agree the coin hobby is changing .. I think it always has. I think most changes are a good thing

But I do think the "crazies" out there trying to sell coins at far above their real worth,
really hurts the hobby. And not just at coin shows, HSN, QVC and coin adds that sell coins at
..crazy high price .. or gold plated buffalo fake coins are also very very bad.

Once a person is really burned in a coin purchase, could caused that person to stop being
a coin collector

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DVCollector's Avatar
United States
10045 Posts
 Posted 01/19/2012  8:22 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add DVCollector to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
DVC, What you are thinking may or may not be true in regards to the future.
Right--just postulating on the future, based on trends I've observed already. Everyone with their hands in something wants it to keep going up--there's a lot of belief involved. Time always has a way of sorting things out.
Rest in Peace
biggfredd's Avatar
United States
9104 Posts
 Posted 01/19/2012  8:34 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add biggfredd to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
I remember back when all coins were just raw or in 2x2's. Slowly more and more coins are appearing in slabs at coin shows. Lately I think about 50% of all coins at some of the shows I go to are in slabs.

There are about 40 million slobbed coins, with an average price in excess of $1,000 each.

Are there a trillion coins? Let's say 100 billion.

That means only one coin out of 2500 is slobbed.
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sel_69l's Avatar
Australia
21788 Posts
 Posted 01/19/2012  8:46 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add sel_69l to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Bullion price were mentioned in earlier posts.
From over 40 years of collecting, I have found that bullion prices do indeed have an immediate but indirect influence on the whole of the numismatic market.

Another major variable I have perceived is the exchange rates of currencies. For most U.S. collectors, they would have seen an increase in numismatic prices that follows inversely with the decline in the value of the U.S. Dollar. There is some lag in exchange rates vis s vis numismatic prices, as numismatic inventories are rolled over.

The third major influence is the increasing numbers of collectors that enter the market. This increasing demand is somewhat ameliorated however, by some of the new customers investing in new issues, rather than in the existing stock of U.S. classic coins, where the total inventory available to the market cannot be expanded.

All of these issues can to be sidestepped to some extent by expanding your interests over the whole of the numismatic market.

See my previous post in this thresd.
Bedrock of the Community
United States
20753 Posts
 Posted 01/20/2012  10:43 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add just carl to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
There are about 40 million slobbed coins, with an average price in excess of $1,000 each.

Are there a trillion coins? Let's say 100 billion.

That means only one coin out of 2500 is slobbed.


Possibly true. At almost all coin shows most dealers have some 3 ringed binders full of those 20 pocket plastic pages full of 2x2's. I'm most I've looked through they contain coins of practically no real Numismatic value but are purchased by many to fill empty slots in Albums or Folders.
However, not sure where you see the average slabbed coins in excess of $1,000. At all the coin shows I go to, I see probably less than 1% in that price range. And that is from 2 to 4 coin shows a Month. Although due to weather lately, only about 2 a Month. One dealer I do much of my purchasing with has possibly a thousand slabbed coins and so far NONE are in that price range. He has a coin store and usually 3 to 4 tables at a show.
And it could well be true that only one in 2,500 coins are slabbed. But those are the ones at coin shows and coin stores.
Take away all the coins in wishing wells, on RR tracks, in cans, bottles, boxes in homes, in bank vaults, our pockets, in vending machines, gum ball machines and that leaves nothing left to slab.
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jbuck's Avatar
United States
188560 Posts
 Posted 01/20/2012  11:53 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add jbuck to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
At almost all coin shows most dealers have some 3 ringed binders full of those 20 pocket plastic pages full of 2x2's
At my shows, there are still plenty of dealers with multiple binders to look through. They may have them out on the table to freely view, or you may have to ask for one. I have filled many Dansco holes from these sources.
Pillar of the Community
United States
684 Posts
 Posted 01/20/2012  10:44 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Westwood Arms to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I have seen demand from Mexico and China for Mexican coins pick up in the last few years. Slabs are preferred.
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RogerRamjet's Avatar
United States
172 Posts
 Posted 01/21/2012  01:00 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add RogerRamjet to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Interesting thread. As mentioned previously, the demographic shift as the baby boomers grow older is having a big effect on both supply and demand. Another major cultural shift involves the fact that most people don't use cash anymore, at least in the US. I know my children think of coins as "antiques" and that attitude is bound to increase rapidly, with or without interesting State Quarters. Like it or not, fully electronic transactions will be the only kind of transaction before long.

Those things would depress me if it weren't for the much more important cultural phenomenon called the Internet. When I was young, coins and coin information were scarce and I'd have to wait all month for the local coin club meeting to be able to talk to anybody about coins. Now, whenever I like, I can have interesting conversations like this one, shop for coins from every corner of the globe, learn about Indian Head die varieties, research Ottoman Empire coins, learn about the historical context of a coin, and get useful answers to any question I can think of. In other words, from a collector's perspective, the Internet has made coin collecting much more rewarding than it used to be.

Many people have the urge to collect things they like. Beautiful, interesting, historical, valuable, and conveniently small antiques will always be popular collector's items. As our society increasingly substitutes virtual objects for physical objects, I don't see other physical objects scratching the same itch any time soon.
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biggfredd's Avatar
United States
9104 Posts
 Posted 01/21/2012  10:48 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add biggfredd to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
However, not sure where you see the average slabbed coins in excess of $1,000. At all the coin shows I go to, I see probably less than 1% in that price range.

That's because you're looking at leftovers after their good customers get the nice ones.

The front page of http://www.pcgs.com has the value info.
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collectorplay's Avatar
United States
137 Posts
 Posted 01/21/2012  7:03 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add collectorplay to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I haven't noticed any crazy pricing at my recent coin show visits. However, my latest coin show story from last month is great; I chose 3 coins that the dealer had a total price of $45, I offered $35 for them and he accepted. I had two $20 bills for payment but he said he had no change for that. He asked what else I had, I said $7, and he said he would take $27 for the coins. I thanked him and left very happy.
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gawd0wns's Avatar
Canada
464 Posts
 Posted 01/21/2012  9:51 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add gawd0wns to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
When I started collecting about 20 years ago, a majority of the people I saw collecting were collectors with an actual interest in coins...Mind you, I was very young. Nowadays, I feel the collecting scene has shifted from collectors to investors who have no interest in the hobby, except to see how much they can get away with charging.

It isn't only coin shows, it is happening everywhere. I especially hate to see sellers charging FMV for damamged/clean coins...It drives me nuts!
Edited by gawd0wns
01/21/2012 9:54 pm
Bedrock of the Community
United States
20753 Posts
 Posted 01/23/2012  12:01 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add just carl to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
When I started collecting about 20 years ago, a majority of the people I saw collecting were collectors with an actual interest in coins...Mind you, I was very young. Nowadays, I feel the collecting scene has shifted from collectors to investors who have no interest in the hobby, except to see how much they can get away with charging.

Paartially true but you must remember that with the internet you now see a much larger quantity of individuals dabbling with coins. There were probably alwayss the same percentage of people buying and selling for a hobby and as a means of profit. The main thing today is you now see it on a massively larger scale. Of course you see many more investors, but there are also a similar increase in collectors.

Quote:
That's because you're looking at leftovers after their good customers get the nice ones.

For sure not true biggfred. I make it a habit to get to most coin shows as they open. Many times while the sellers are setting up. Still seldom see coins in slabs for over $1,000. And I've seen many for prices far below what it must have costs to put them in slabs since the ones in the slabs are basic coins only. Never could figure that one out.
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Earle42's Avatar
United States
10038 Posts
 Posted 01/23/2012  12:20 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Earle42 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
When I started collecting about 20 years ago, a majority of the people I saw collecting were collectors with an actual interest in coins...Mind you, I was very young. Nowadays, I feel the collecting scene has shifted from collectors to investors who have no interest in the hobby, except to see how much they can get away with charging.


i also believe this is partly due to grading services. It used to be that every coin had its own value depending on mintage. Nowadays unless a coin is a key, semi key, or in top condition, its value is pretty much all the same (eg. "junk" silver).

I remember the day I first heard the term "Full Steps" and "Full Bell Lines." Yes, these are fun to pursue and it gives a collector a good feeling knowing they have as near a perfect coin as they can get. But the other side of the coin is that good looking pieces without a strong strike lost some of their appeal and value.

There was a new focus on perfection opened the door for people to look for bargains for monetary profit. Again, this had an unplanned effect of devaluing a lot of pieces as people look through/passed over what used to be considered better coins to find the one that will bring them more value.


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