Coin Community Family of Web Sites Join Thousands of Coin, Bullion, & Money Collectors
300,000 items to help build your collection! Royal Canadian Mint products, Canadian, Polish, American, and world coins and banknotes. Royal Estate Auctions - $1 Coin AuctionsCoin, Banknote and Medal Collectors's Online Mall Vancouvers #1 Coin and Paper Money Dealer Specializing in Modern Numismatics Join Thousands of Coin, Bullion, & Money Collectors








Username:
Password:
Save Password
Forgot your Password?


This page may contain links that result in small commissions to keep this free site up and running.

Welcome Guest! Registering and/or logging in will remove the anchor (bottom) ads. It's Free!

Why I Stay Away From High Numismatics.....

To participate in the forum you must log in or register.
Author Previous TopicReplies: 16 / Views: 2,862Next Topic
Page: of 2
Valued Member
colu41's Avatar
United States
376 Posts
 Posted 10/08/2012  2:10 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add colu41 to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
Try to stay away at least. And this is just my opinion and I wanted to see what everyone else thought.

My example; When I started buying at about $26 an oz, I could go down to my local coin shop, buy any common date Morgan for $22 and sell it online for $28-$32. Which was awesome, because at that time I could spin that into an ASE no problem and have a buck left over.

Now that silver is pushing $35 +\- a $1, ASE are now running anywhere between $38 and $40. While that same common date Morgan is still only going for around $30.

This is just what I've noticed and how I feel about high premium coins. Will they hold that steady premium if say there were an even bigger price jump?
Valued Member
Clint's Avatar
United States
194 Posts
 Posted 10/08/2012  2:23 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Clint to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Great point. I think it's important to call 'em for what they are: bullion for bullion, numis for numis. I think people may lose when they try to use numis for bullion or vice-versa. Obviously there are exceptions...
Pillar of the Community
matthewvincent's Avatar
United States
3486 Posts
 Posted 10/08/2012  3:05 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add matthewvincent to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
colu41,
I believe you are confusing numismatics (high or not) with bullion speculation.
To buy common dollars low and to sell them at a profit is fine as long as you do not confuse this practice
with buying select examples to hold and to admire.
There is room for all to follow each one's particular interest.
Clint made a great point: do not confuse the two.
Both are valid pursuits, but one is apples and the other is oranges.
Pillar of the Community
Fat Freddy's Avatar
United States
1200 Posts
 Posted 10/08/2012  3:23 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Fat Freddy to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Just out of curiosity... As a relatively unenlightened newbie, I see those "America The Beautiful" 5 oz silver bullion coins as a good example of that potentially costly practice of seeing bullion as having numismatic value. They're priced (retail) @ a moderately premium level, yet lots of people are going haywire with getting them graded, slabbed and trying to sell them for wacky high prices on ebay. I see them as slightly overpriced bullion and not something it would be wise to attribute too much numismatic value to. Am I on the beam here or am I mis-reading this situation?
Pillar of the Community
unholyroller's Avatar
United States
1903 Posts
 Posted 10/08/2012  3:39 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add unholyroller to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
To me...

If you are in it for the money...short term or long....they are all bullion.
If you are in it for the pure enjoyment...short term or long...they are all numismatic.

To me it is as simple as that...determine which camp you live in, because the rules for each are very very different! Sure....you can dabble in both, but just know, understand, and live by the rules of each and don't get them muddied up and you will do great.
Pillar of the Community
matthewvincent's Avatar
United States
3486 Posts
 Posted 10/08/2012  4:23 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add matthewvincent to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Fat Freddy - You are 5 by 5 on the beam!
How ... astute of you to throw the hype aside and
to call a spade a spade.
Bullion, in the guise of Mint hype and three layers of third party grading is still --- BULLION!
Valued Member
colu41's Avatar
United States
376 Posts
 Posted 10/08/2012  5:07 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add colu41 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Im (in all reality) definitely in it for the long haul. The few Morgans I bought and sold were just to quickly build up my ASE stack :).
I was just trying to see if (for example) paying $150 + for an 1879 CC Morgan dollar when, I see it as, if that melts in a house fire, its currently worth no more than $26.30. lol. Thats just my opinion I guess. I dont want to start an argument with the high end collectors on here. I respect what you do, I just cant bring myself to do it.
Bedrock of the Community
basebal21's Avatar
13014 Posts
 Posted 10/08/2012  5:12 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add basebal21 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Just out of curiosity... As a relatively unenlightened newbie, I see those "America The Beautiful" 5 oz silver bullion coins as a good example of that potentially costly practice of seeing bullion as having numismatic value. They're priced (retail) @ a moderately premium level, yet lots of people are going haywire with getting them graded, slabbed and trying to sell them for wacky high prices on ebay.


Theres two kinds of those. The bullion version and the P collectors version. Most of the graded ones you see are the P version. But a lot of people have switched from the P version to collecting the bullion version because for a while the mint was charging and 80 or so dollar premium on them
Pillar of the Community
trdhrdr007's Avatar
United States
2335 Posts
 Posted 10/08/2012  5:26 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add trdhrdr007 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
There's a huge difference between the Morgans that sell for close to melt and a coin with significant numismatic value. If you pay $150+ for an 1879 CC Morgan(assuming that's market value) & the price of silver drops to $5/ozt you probably won't lose much, if any, value.

The Morgan's in your example have pretty much always sold for melt + a small premium. There isn't much of a numismatic premium. Your ability to buy low & sell high is an example of arbitrage, which is the practice of taking advantage of a price difference between 2 markets.
Valued Member
Coinaholic73's Avatar
United Kingdom
298 Posts
 Posted 10/08/2012  6:49 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Coinaholic73 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Agree with the above. Working with UK currency here but you'll get the example, I bought a lunar year of the dragon when spot was $44 and it cost me 43GBP. Spot is now $10 lower but my 1oz dragon is worth a minimum 50GBP.
Pillar of the Community
Silverhawk74's Avatar
United States
3670 Posts
 Posted 10/08/2012  7:08 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Silverhawk74 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I don't like buying at these prices, but I said you know what now is a good time to go after the TRUE high end stuff, since prices rarely come down on them anyway when prices drop, so low 40's per oz. is not too bad on some things....

For example new additions, pics later.....

1. Perth Mint Lunar set, 1st series on running auction great price under 900....

2. Worked out deal with TBK to get back a 10 oz. ox. bar and that Gateway 25 oz. old bar I sold him recently....

3. I grabbed a sea turtle five oz. Fiji round as well, or 52 oz. total....

I have an average of right at 76 per coin in the 1st series Lunar set, but as we all know they bring bigger money every day, week, month, and year. But great deal on the rest of it, so my total cost is up there over 2k, but total cost per oz. averaged out of all 52 oz. is 47 per. Still seems high 47 per, but the Lunar set at 76 per for 12 coins pushed that up there....

TBK gave me great deals real close to spot as always, thanks again!!

If it was generic rounds not such a good deal, but could be worse on the high end stuff, and those complete Lunar sets 1st series are more and more scarce, as many were chopped up and sold out solo, box and all I fig....

Try and complete all 12 buying each solo on bay for under 900, good luck.....
Edited by Silverhawk74
10/08/2012 7:13 pm
Pillar of the Community
bekiz's Avatar
Japan
666 Posts
 Posted 10/08/2012  7:32 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add bekiz to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Hawk, lunars are nice ... I still try to push myself into buying the whole set, though time to time buy separate coins for much less they sell on ebay.

As of me I collect all the pretty bullion I can think of without paying ridiculously high premiums over spot. So far did make pretty good collection of misc. bullion coins. Of course average cost for them is higher than the bullion value, but the average price on ebay even higher than this. It means I've got pretty good downside protection.

Saying all that I'm thinking of selling collectible and adding some to bullion from the proceeds. I've counted that by selling 10 oz of collectible I will be able to buy some 16-18 oz of common 999 bullion, but it is so hard to let the coins slip ))

Pillar of the Community
Ed_B's Avatar
United States
4008 Posts
 Posted 10/09/2012  6:34 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Ed_B to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
One of the true secrets of financial success is to "know what you don't know". I have little to no knowledge of real numismatic coins, have no intention of acquiring such knowledge, and do not buy them. Knowledge is power and when you jump into a game in which you do not know who the victim is, it is YOU. Make mine bullion all the way. That I understand and can deal with.
Pillar of the Community
Silverhawk74's Avatar
United States
3670 Posts
 Posted 10/09/2012  9:37 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Silverhawk74 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Stick with what you know never hurts eh Ed, and Bekiz I wish I had your silver sources outside of bay, lol....

I am actually stacking for myself and family for a change verses quick flip on these buys for now anyway, so 47 per spent now will be long forgotten if I can truly keep it and keep stacking....

I am more caught up financially then I have been in some time, a real blessing from God at no better time now weeks away from the baby getting here, if not minutes, lol....

He is already 7 pounds 2 oz. and named Alexander, via first known conquer of most of the known ancient world, via Alexander the great king of Mesopotamia 325 B.C. to say maybe 287 B.C., lol....
Edited by Silverhawk74
10/09/2012 10:21 pm
Valued Member
SDCrow's Avatar
United States
456 Posts
 Posted 10/09/2012  9:47 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add SDCrow to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I don't mean to stray from the OP's topic, but congrats Silverhawk - on more than one front! Good work with the recent buys, but more importantly, your soon-to-be-born son. Wishing nothing but the best for your new family.
Pillar of the Community
Silverhawk74's Avatar
United States
3670 Posts
 Posted 10/09/2012  10:21 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Silverhawk74 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Hey thanks Crow, much appreciated I am real excited and looking forward to the new life experience.....
  Previous TopicReplies: 16 / Views: 2,862Next Topic
Page: of 2

To participate in the forum you must log in or register.



    




Disclaimer: While a tremendous amount of effort goes into ensuring the accuracy of the information contained in this site, Coin Community assumes no liability for errors. Copyright 2005 - 2026 Coin Community Family- all rights reserved worldwide. Use of any images or content on this website without prior written permission of Coin Community or the original lender is strictly prohibited.
Contact Us  |  Advertise Here  |  Privacy Policy / Terms of Use

Coin Community Forum © 2005 - 2026 Coin Community Forums
It took 0.39 seconds to rattle this change. Forums