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Question About Non Reputable TPG's

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murrellington's Avatar
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3276 Posts
 Posted 12/07/2012  03:19 am Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add murrellington to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
Taking NNC (National Numismatic Certification) for example. I know there are a ton of basement slabbers who over grade, typically if I buy graded I go with the pcgs/ngc/anacs/icg crowd.

I wouldn't completely trust grades of other companies such as NNC, but can you trust that the coin is genuine? Or that it is not cleaned?
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CoinsKelly's Avatar
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 Posted 12/07/2012  06:53 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add CoinsKelly to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I guess I would approach the coin as if it were just in a 2x2 in with a fancy package. Anyone can write whatever they want on a 2x2. If I were unsure of whether or not it was genuine, I would at minimum post for opinions here but most likely would pass on it. So no, I would not trust what is listed but I would still consider the coin if it was something I wanted and was positive of its authenticity.

Caveat emptor, I say.
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Sap's Avatar
Australia
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 Posted 12/07/2012  07:42 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Sap to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
I wouldn't completely trust grades of other companies such as NNC, but can you trust that the coin is genuine? Or that it is not cleaned?

No. Frankly, the grade is just as untrustworthy as everything else claimed on a basement slab.

You cannot trust the coin has been properly identified.

You cannot trust that it has not been cleaned or has other problems which one of the genuinely third party companies would reject the coin for.

You cannot trust that it is actually a genuine coin.
Don't say "infinitely" when you mean "very"; otherwise, you'll have no word left when you want to talk about something really infinite. - C. S. Lewis
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SeatedNut's Avatar
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 Posted 12/07/2012  09:40 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add SeatedNut to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I've purchased a few NNC slabbed coins with varieties that I was looking for and at a reasonable price. Over half were cleaned. The others crossed to PCGS at grades at least two points lower (example: MS65 = MS62). All of the coins were genuine. If you take the gamble, and are able to grade in-hand, make sure the seller has a decent return policy (review feedback on ebay for return issues).
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SsuperDdave's Avatar
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 Posted 12/07/2012  11:01 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add SsuperDdave to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
NNC is a particularly egregious one - the guy behind them is an established coin guy - a former finalist in a PCGS grading contest - who deliberately hose the Dark Side.
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SeatedNut's Avatar
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 Posted 12/07/2012  4:02 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add SeatedNut to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
NNC is a particularly egregious one - the guy behind them is an established coin guy - a former finalist in a PCGS grading contest - who deliberately hose the Dark Side.


Dave, this post is Centsles without a name.
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Conder101's Avatar
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 Posted 12/08/2012  09:14 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Conder101 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
It depends on how non reputable the company is. For a lot of the basement slabbers you definitely can't trust the grades, but mostly they slab moderns and they are almost certainly genuine. Of the small number of older coins they slab most will be real with the number of questionable pieces rising as the value rise.

For many of the older small and now mostly defunct services again you still can't trust the grades but most of them were serious about trying to make sure the coins were genuine. You will be pretty safe.

With the second tier companies both current and defunct grades are questionable, but authenticity is pretty solid, about a well as the major firms.

With the major firms grading in my opinion can still be questionable but authenticity risk is approaching 0%.


Quote:
You cannot trust the coin has been properly identified.

You can't trust that from the top two firms. The top best at proper identification are SEGS and then ANACS. Probably then followed by ICG, NGC and finally PCGS.

Frankly no matter who slabbed the coin YOU need to verify as much as possible yourself. Don't just take the TPG's word for it. The big advantage of the top firms though is in the case they do make a mistake, they will usually stand behind their work. (I say usually because in the case of NGC if you buy a coin based on an attribution on the holder and it turns out to be wrong you are out of luck. Attributions are not guaranteed. Also in the case of copper if the color turns you are not protected.)
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