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Can I Trust PCGS Holders If I Go To A Coin Show

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blackjack's Avatar
United States
386 Posts
 Posted 01/02/2013  1:07 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add blackjack to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
I will appreciate any advise you can give me. I purchase from a LCS and the Mint but I am thinking about attending coin shows in order to widen what's available to me.
My concern is about getting a counterfeit from a buyer that I don't know.
From your experience can I feel okay about buying a coin if it's in a PCGS or NGC holder? Thank you.

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SeatedNut's Avatar
United States
2797 Posts
 Posted 01/02/2013  2:23 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add SeatedNut to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Short answer is Yes. If your concern is counterfeits, both have industry-best detection methods. Accurate grading is another matter and subjective.

In the past both have holdered counterfeits. I wished I would have purchased a few. PCGS mistakenly authenticated the small 'O' Morgan dollars from 1900, 1901 and 1902. These were privately made and were discovered to be counterfeits less than 10 years ago. Those that made it into PCGS plastic are popular with collectors and priced accordingly.
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jerseyben's Avatar
United States
1211 Posts
 Posted 01/02/2013  2:31 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add jerseyben to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The good thing about buying coins in person is, if you have a doubt, you can always arrange to get a 2nd opinion.
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Conder101's Avatar
United States
17884 Posts
 Posted 01/02/2013  4:02 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Conder101 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
While a lot of people have said that fake PCGS and NGC slab are commonly encountered at shows, I've run into very few of them. Of course 'm not able to attend the really big shows, maybe they are more common there. But as for coins in genuine PCGS, NGC, ANACS, SEGS, and ICG slabs not only are counterfeits in these slabs extremely rare, but if one does turn up the company will reimburse you for it. So you run no real risk.
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blackjack's Avatar
United States
386 Posts
 Posted 01/02/2013  4:34 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add blackjack to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
So, I can feel good if I find a deal, even a counterfeit would a) have value, b) a coin PCGS would reimburse me for. I'm glad I've asked. I value your responses. Commems has rekindled my desire for a few commemorative half dollars and the coins I'm seeing in two LCS's are below the grade I want or overpriced or not lustrous. There's a new coin shop nearby and I am disappointed in their pricing. I'm wondering if they hope to get rich--and lucky--in a short period of time. I looked at an ungraded BU Stone Mountain today, maybe it's an MS64, but not appealing, really. It doesn't stand out at all and the guy wants $200.00 for it. That's a worse price than I see from one of the high-priced internet shops I browse just for the heck of it. I'm kinda sorry I even went into the shop and talked with the guy. Strikes me that he has no respect for a collector.
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 Posted 01/03/2013  12:37 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add just carl to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
As noted your fairly safe purchasing slabbed coins by the big named TPGS's. However, not only are there faked slabbed coins in faked slabs, but some really good people know how to open a slab, change the coin, reseal the slab so it is hardly noitced. Yes a close inspection by someone that knows slabs can possibly see where it was done, but not as much as people think. I've been shown slabs that were opened and the coin replaced as a joke and asked if I could see where it was done. I could not. The one I saw said it was a Cent but it was a Dime. I go to about 2 to 4 coin shows a Month and never sure about lots of things but it pays to ask.
One of the great things about coin shows is if you go to them often enough, you'll get to know some dealers that are more frequent. If in doubt about a coin, a slab, etc., just ask them. Sort of like having a second opinion about an operation. Nothing to loose by asking.
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BadThad's Avatar
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19935 Posts
 Posted 01/03/2013  3:18 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add BadThad to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
So, I can feel good if I find a deal, even a counterfeit would a) have value, b) a coin PCGS would reimburse me for. I'm glad I've asked. I value your responses. Commems has rekindled my desire for a few commemorative half dollars and the coins I'm seeing in two LCS's are below the grade I want or overpriced or not lustrous. There's a new coin shop nearby and I am disappointed in their pricing. I'm wondering if they hope to get rich--and lucky--in a short period of time. I looked at an ungraded BU Stone Mountain today, maybe it's an MS64, but not appealing, really. It doesn't stand out at all and the guy wants $200.00 for it. That's a worse price than I see from one of the high-priced internet shops I browse just for the heck of it. I'm kinda sorry I even went into the shop and talked with the guy. Strikes me that he has no respect for a collector.


Come to his shop with your Greysheets in hand. Use that for negotiation. It works VERY well for me with dealers.
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blackjack's Avatar
United States
386 Posts
 Posted 01/03/2013  4:42 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add blackjack to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
@just carl: Yes, my fear is that someone can open and reseal a holder, but, as you say, I'll trust someone and ask if I'm suspicious.
@BadThad: I don't go to that shop. I go somewhere else and will continue to do so. But, you know, this other coin dealer I met is what you don't want when you go into a coin shop. It's downright insulting. I can appreciate what I have where I normally go.
Pillar of the Community
United States
511 Posts
 Posted 01/03/2013  8:22 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add 3stooges to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
You're fine with PCGS and NGC, but not all MS-63s or -64s are equal. Examine each coin carefully.
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blackjack's Avatar
United States
386 Posts
 Posted 01/04/2013  07:57 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add blackjack to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
You're fine with PCGS and NGC, but not all MS-63s or -64s are equal. Examine each coin carefully.

Yes, I'm learning this. It takes a while to catch on but I see that my MS64s are not equal. I don't know why standards vary like this. Isn't there a three-grader panel that decides the grade of each coin?
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basebal21's Avatar
13014 Posts
 Posted 01/04/2013  4:48 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add basebal21 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
I don't know why standards vary like this. Isn't there a three-grader panel that decides the grade of each coin?


Multiple graders do grade the coins and have to agree or at least come to a consensus. But the coins within a grade will vary for a few reasons.
There will always be high end of the grade coins and low end of the grade coins.
Toning also doesn't affect the strike quality so a coin could look ugly as sin but have the proper detail and be uncirculated ect.
Then theres also how people have stored them. The slabs do a great job protecting the coin, but how their stored can still take its toll over time.
Then of course theres also mistakes. The vast majority of the coins are exactly what they say they are, but they are human and mistakes will happen.
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vermontensium's Avatar
United States
16677 Posts
 Posted 01/04/2013  7:14 pm  Show Profile   Check vermontensium's eBay Listings Check vermontensium's eCrater Listings Bookmark this reply Add vermontensium to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
just carl's last comment are my sentiments as well.
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nickelsearcher's Avatar
United States
15395 Posts
 Posted 01/04/2013  7:27 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add nickelsearcher to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I've read all the previous replies ... IMHO your are completely safe purchasing coins in PCGS or NGC coins at any show ...

Trust that any attempt to 'swap' the coins will result in ugly and obvious damage to the holder ...

The only risk IMHO is grade-flation ... whereby coins might be over-graded. Defense against that is knowledge.

David
Take a look at my other hobby ... http://www.jk-dk.art
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blackjack's Avatar
United States
386 Posts
 Posted 01/05/2013  06:59 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add blackjack to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Everyone is very helpful and I am grateful for your help. I learn a lot here.
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