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Confession Of An Ex-Stacker

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Pillar of the Community
barryg's Avatar
United States
5841 Posts
 Posted 05/15/2013  09:00 am Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add barryg to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
All right, so maybe my story isn't quite as lurid as the title suggests, but bear with me...

When I got back into coin collecting a few years ago after a long absence, I was purely interested in coins from a numismatic value. The only silver and gold I cared about were old coins that I needed to fill various holes in my albums. And prior to that time I had NEVER been interested in buying gold and silver as an investment since I always felt that the fact that prices had basically remained constant during the 80s and 90s was an indication that PMs simply weren't a very good investment compared to, say, stocks, real estate or even bank interest.

When gold hit $1300 and silver hit $20 back around September of 2010, my wife tried to convince me that we should start buying some. I told her that it was a bad idea since PMs were not traditionally a good long-term investment and likely wouldn't go much higher.

By the time gold hit $1600 and silver was above $40 nearly a year later, I finally let myself be convinced that maybe things had indeed fundamentally changed and that gold and silver really did have long-term investment potential. My wife was absolutely convinced that the economy was heading for a long-term disaster and there was certainly a lot of support for her views all over the Internet (including here on this very forum). And so I started buying pure silver bullion for the first time. And I continued to do so regularly over the next couple of years, "buying the dips" as spot price slowly dropped during that entire period. A small amount of gold as well, especially in recent months.

Now, just to be clear about a few things... My wife and I have both worked hard for many years and had put away a sizable amount of money toward our son's eventual college education. Any PM purchases I made came from current income that we otherwise would have added to savings, not from existing savings. Also, I never bought into the doomsday scenarios that predicted total economic collapse. Instead, I always looked as PMs as a way to preserve wealth from the vicissitudes of inflation in the long-term and planned to either spend it as necessary upon retirement in 20 years or else pass it along to my son if I didn't need to spend it. All of which is to say that we never spent money we didn't have or couldn't afford, and I don't regret "buying the dips" on the way down since (a) I still think prices will go up again and (b) buying a little at a time over a couple of years let me buy much more than had I waited two years and purchased now since there's no way I would have ever dropped $100K at once.

So now, what with prices lower than they've been in years, you'd think I'd be backing up the truck, right? Wrong, actually. And this is where the "ex-stacker" part comes in. Lately I've gotten into the habit of buying simply because I'm in the habit of buying. But I've recently realized that we now have a significant amount stashed away and there's really no reason for us to buy anything else purely for the sake of stacking. Sure, if I were convinced that the economy were going to collapse and silver and gold would be the only thing that would let us survive, I would liquidate my son's college fund in a heartbeat. Same thing if I were absolutely convinced that silver was going to hit $500 someday. But I'm not convinced of either of those scenarios (even though I admit they could happen).

I'm still planning on purchasing "specialty" PM items, such as the 5-ounce ATB pucks, the yearly ASE sets, etc. But I honestly have no plans to buy any more 100-ounce silver bars, tubes (or monster boxes) of ASEs, etc. I certainly don't regret the purchases I have made and I'm not at all depressed about the current spot price which is below what I paid. But with PMs making up approximately 1/3 of our investments right now (not including our house and 401K plans), I think it's time to stop buying PMs simply because I'm in the habit of doing so.
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Northerncoins's Avatar
Canada
2019 Posts
 Posted 05/15/2013  04:57 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Northerncoins to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Brings up a good point, how many ounces of silver do you really need if your a stacker 500 ounces ? 1000 ounces? 5000 ounces?

How many ounces of gold do you need? 10 ounces 50 , 100 ?

Copper 100 LBs?

Nickel 100 LBs?
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starbuxinvestor's Avatar
United Kingdom
616 Posts
 Posted 05/15/2013  09:24 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add starbuxinvestor to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
For me right now buying Silver is like playing a very slow game of Blackjack with primarily ASEs being the chips. So when I see what I think is a good price I buy a tube and take it unopened to the SDB with the hopes someday I will open the SDB and it will be worth something big. Having said that I don't count my PM as part of my investment portfolio nor do I track it's value on purpose. This is something for years from now or to surprise my hiers when they open the SDB. Each year I do get a Kook, Brit, Panda and Koala. And lately I have been fascinated by 10 oz. coins. Sort of a cross between tubes and attractive coins maybe a slow game of slots. To be honest if I cover my premiums and shipping when I sell I will be happy, if silver goes to $50 I will be thrilled and if I lose 50% that's fine. I am not depending on the money I put into PMs for anything just like I wouldn't count on bringing any money back from a trip to Vegas. But hopefully someday in the future I will be very pleasantly surprised. Either way I will have had fun in the casino.
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barryg's Avatar
United States
5841 Posts
 Posted 05/15/2013  11:23 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add barryg to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
OK, now I'm confused... According to the message time stamps, Northerncoins responded to my initial post 6 hours 23 minutes ago. My initial post was only 2 hours 20 minutes ago, however.

If Northercoins has a functioning time machine, do you think I could borrow it and go back to when silver was $5 and gold was $300? That might be enough to convince me to start stacking again...
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Northerncoins's Avatar
Canada
2019 Posts
 Posted 05/15/2013  11:28 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Northerncoins to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Oops didn't mean to use my time machine on this post lol...

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Demarco Bishopp's Avatar
United Kingdom
548 Posts
 Posted 05/15/2013  1:28 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Demarco Bishopp to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
To me investing in precious metals is just way too risky. There are people who do it every day to earn a living and even they get it wrong so what chance does a man in the street have? My collection of silver and gold is like owning my own pirates treasure. I like the fact that it's there, but I'd be a fool to count on it in the future.
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barryg's Avatar
United States
5841 Posts
 Posted 05/15/2013  1:49 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add barryg to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
I'd be a fool to count on it in the future


I think that's very wise. When I first got into stacking, I'll admit I was lured by the thought that maybe silver was going to hit $100 or even $500 some day and I would be rich if I bought it at today's prices. But at no time did I buy thinking I would absolutely need it to live off some day. That's what our 401K retirement plans and Social Security are for (and, if all else fails, our son can take care of us). The problem I found, however, is that once you start seriously stacking it's very hard to stop. Even today, when prices had dropped sharply this morning, I had to really resist the urge to make another purchase. But I did resist.

Fortunately, unlike many investments that exist solely on paper and may someday be worthless, I know that PMs will never have zero value and will not likely return to historic lows. Plus, I can always hold them in my hand and ooh and aah over them...
Pillar of the Community
United States
2168 Posts
 Posted 05/15/2013  1:55 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add angel2004 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I haven't watched premiums lately ( 2 wks). Had a hard time thinking about a 15 to 20 percent premium over spot to stack bullion/junk.
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barryg's Avatar
United States
5841 Posts
 Posted 05/15/2013  2:00 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add barryg to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Premiums are actually starting to come down a bit. APMEX, for example, had ASEs for sale yesterday at $3.99 per coin over spot (any quantity). Not a great price compared to a couple of months ago when they could be found for as little as $2.49 over spot, but certainly better than a couple of weeks ago when they were $8+ over spot (assuming you could even find any).

But that's neither here nor there, since I didn't buy any...
Valued Member
rgathright's Avatar
United States
264 Posts
 Posted 05/15/2013  3:08 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add rgathright to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
BarryG; Very good post.

Until I stopped, I found myself stacking as a hobby too. Trading out of PM's is where the established dealer/pawn broker network makes their $$$.

For me, as a 30+ y/o man, I have never physically touched .999 silver bullion until 2 years ago! Now, I am glad it is all gone and can move on to more interesting hobbies in life.
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Connor's Avatar
United States
2130 Posts
 Posted 05/15/2013  3:20 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Connor to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Barry...I don't really post a lot but I visit the precious metal forum daily. I will miss your pictures of the huge purchases you made. In my opinion...your best post ever was when you ordered several ounces of silver while you were in the emergency room. You know you have been bitten by the "stacking bug" when that happens.
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barryg's Avatar
United States
5841 Posts
 Posted 05/15/2013  3:21 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add barryg to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Now, I am glad it is all gone and can move on to more interesting hobbies in life.


Well, I never said I was getting rid of what I have -- just not gonna be buying any more (at least not in bulk quantities)...
Bedrock of the Community
basebal21's Avatar
13014 Posts
 Posted 05/15/2013  4:51 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add basebal21 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
The problem I found, however, is that once you start seriously stacking it's very hard to stop.


Amen, thats the problem with coins in general. Once you get started its hard to stop
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SteveCaruso's Avatar
United States
1796 Posts
 Posted 05/15/2013  5:34 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add SteveCaruso to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Each year I do get a Kook, Brit, Panda and Koala.


For a split moment there I thought you were being racist... and then reality, backed by context, re-asserted itself. :-)

However, more seriously:

Coin collecting (and bullion collecting) like any hobby can be addictive. It can be compulsive, and it can become habitual. Often I find myself scanning ebay listings for various things related to my hobbies in general, scouring my feeds for some overlooked gem or great deal, or something that *may* appreciate suddenly in value (because then I "win!"; instant gratification), but in doing so I've also been sure to train myself into saying "NO!" :-)

In the end, I'm happier, and if something really is a gem I might go for it, as my wallet isn't as light as it would be otherwise.
Edited by SteveCaruso
05/15/2013 5:35 pm
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jbuck's Avatar
United States
187862 Posts
 Posted 05/15/2013  5:41 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add jbuck to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
OK, now I'm confused... According to the message time stamps...
CCF moved to a new server today. There were some hiccups with the time-date being set correctly.
Pillar of the Community
bekiz's Avatar
Japan
666 Posts
 Posted 05/15/2013  7:27 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add bekiz to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I'm still stacking and will continue to move my fixed fiat allowance toward PM ... this paper games convince me day after day that either any productive asset (which I don't have many to invest in) or commodity (which is gold and silver) should replace at least 25% of fiat I have.


The only risk I have so far - is fiat in bank account ... and that risk is huge comparing it to PM. Today I'm able to pay for 1 year of college for my 3 year old daughter ... this money stays in bank and I'm 100% sure I'll not be able to pay for the same 1 year in college 15 years from now with the same fiat. With PM I have a high chance of making it.

So far sold some silver for $38/oz (like early maples, philharmonicas etc,), added gold as replacement


P.S. I'm in PM since 2010
Edited by bekiz
05/15/2013 7:28 pm
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