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 Replies: 17 / Views: 2,354 |
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Pillar of the Community
United Kingdom
552 Posts |
I bought a group lot of about 100 coins unseen and these two were amongst them on arrival. I take it one is a one reale 1773...Spain...any interesting features? Value in this grade? The other coin, I have no idea at all.     |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
3499 Posts |
marbury518- Nice finds! While I don't have my books on hand at the moment to tell you the approximate values, your first coin is actually a 1 Real from Mexico (colonial Spain), and it is a rare variety. You will notice that one the reverse the mint mark and assayer's initials are facing outward, unlike the other letters of the reverse that face inwards. So a really nice coin to find in fine-very fine(US grading standards) condition.
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Pillar of the Community
 United Kingdom
552 Posts |
That's great news, I couldn't understand why the letters were like that and just seemed upside down to me.
The lot came with
8 reales 1891 Z F Z UNC stunning
British half crown 1836
Manchester half penny token 1793
Gun money Irelands Advocate May Our Freedom Prosper
Straits Settlements 10c 1926 nice grade
British 1917 sixpence nice, 1939 and 1941 UNC
1964 Kennedy 50c proof stunning
1902 British half penny EF or Unc
British 1918 and 1913 shillings nice
South Africa 1896 sixpence VF perhaps
British 1758 shilling VF perhaps......and many others less useful.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
3499 Posts |
marbury518- Wow! It sounds like you got a really nice lot of coins. If you want to post pics, I, and presumably others, would love to see them.
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Pillar of the Community
United Kingdom
552 Posts |
Doing all that optimising on this site takes ages....but any specific one I will post for you.......I got 100 coins for £96 group lot at auction without seeing any of the coins. I guess I did OK.....
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Valued Member
United States
136 Posts |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
3499 Posts |
marbury518- I think that you did quite well!
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Pillar of the Community
United Kingdom
552 Posts |
1288 looks just over an inch across....kids nicked my scales it seems...
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Pillar of the Community
United Kingdom
552 Posts |
Archraz.........the resident authority on cointalk said my one reale is common....no variety.....can you confirm?
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Pillar of the Community
United States
3499 Posts |
marbury518- I totally disagree with that person. This is an error type of coin. In fact, this variety is worth more than those whose mint mark and initials face inwards.
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Moderator
 Australia
16837 Posts |
This design was first introduced in Mexico in 1772. All 1 real coins from Mexico dated 1772 and 1773 have the "inverted FM and Mo mintmark". While coins of these two years are slightly more valuable than coins of later years (which have all the lettering the same way around) I wouldn't call them "rare". Just "scarcer".
Historical trivia about this coin: in the late 1700s, official British coinage was fairly hard to come by and foreign coins often circulated. Spanish and Spanish-colonial 1 real coins circulated as equivalent to a sixpence. That they were commonly found in circulation in Ireland can be attested to by noting that the Irish word for "sixpence" is "reul", a name derived from the name of this coin.
Don't say "infinitely" when you mean "very"; otherwise, you'll have no word left when you want to talk about something really infinite. - C. S. Lewis
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1962 Posts |
Marbury - Nice lot overall for the price... Any other earlier Spanish realm material aside from the 1891 Zs? Quote:
1 Real from Mexico (colonial Spain), and it is a rare variety. Quote:
...said my one reale is common....no variety.....can you confirm? It's a "variety" in the sense that the inverted lettering is atypical compared to MOST of the colonial portrait Reales series. I'm not certain whether scholarship has determined that this was an actual "error". I vaguely recall reading something that I think indicated it was intentional - considering that multiple dies would have been produced this way, that would seem to be the case. At any rate, ALL of the 1772 and 1773 dated Mex 1R came this way... and those dates are not scarce compared to others. But, as an overall type... it would of course be somewhat scarcer than Charles III "normal" lettering. People are always quick to make that selling point... just from observation, the inverted type 1R brings an ever-so-slight premium. The situation is generally similar for the other 1772-73 Mex minors... Of course, with the 8R, several of the permutations of these dates are very scarce and bring good money... and even in general, the common type 173 and especially the 1772 dates bring a premium over the following dates... Quote:
the resident authority on cointalk Ah yes... that guy. May I rant? I'd like to rant. I assume you mean the one with the stupid Richard Petty-looking avatar? Oooooh.... does he know SOME stuff? Yes. However, I have read MORE than a few, um, kernels of wisdom related to Reales coinage from him which have made me yell at the computer. I actually started to register on there to post a diatribe debunking much of what I've seen him matter-of-factly, beyond any doubt, "Well, I'm 100% right, I have a lot of books and even have seen a few genuine Spanish reales so TRUST ME I'm right and you're wrong" proclaim in various posts... then decided it wasn't worth it. I do, however, reserve the right in the future... fortunately I only peruse the site occasionally to see if anything interesting comes out the woodwork. However, now you've gone and reminded me... None of that probably matters to anyone, when I read all-encompassing factoids like (I paraphrase) "The cob is fake - the denomination goes on the right, not the left... see here's a photo from (well-known book whose name he name-drops to sound erudite) which proves that I'm right"... it irks me. For the most part, at least in regards to Spanish realm/Reales coinage, that site is amateur hour WITH TWO NOTABLE EXCEPTIONS.... -- that Eduard guy out of Chile, I believe, who knows his stuff and has posted some nice pieces -- the guy who has this website, who has lots of his (also fabulous) pieces imaged: www.coinsandhistory.com |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1801 Posts |
Realeswatcher,
Well stated and well explained.
Marbury518,
I saw this on cointalk and left a brief comment there
Several people I know have beautiful type sets with 1, 2, 4, and 8 reales that include both the inverted initials and the normal initials. Your coin is a definite scarce 2 year only type and as stated above will command a premium price over a later date 1 real from the same monarch.
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Pillar of the Community
United Kingdom
552 Posts |
Thanks so much for the info, really appreciated. Re Richard Petty, he is the Sheriff on the site and can be abrupt shall we say...don't want to get banned so keeping quiet. So a two year type inverted lettering, v helpful. Only other Mexican stuff I have are slabbed:
1793 MO FM 8R NGC VF25
1896 MO AB 8R NGC MS61
1889 MO MH 8R NGC MS62
1893 MO AM 8R NGC MS62
1885 MO MH 8R NGC MS62
1898 G0 R 20c NGC MS64
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Pillar of the Community
United Kingdom
552 Posts |
Morocco Falus coin weighs 9.8g.....so can't tell it a 2 or a 4 and it does not correlate exactly with either coin.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1962 Posts |
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Replies: 17 / Views: 2,354 |
Posted 09/06/2013 2:56 pm
