New Chinese Coins-Updated With Info

I can't tell you if they're genuine, but here's what they purport to be:

The top one (No. 2) is a "figure 8" dollar of Kirin Province, China. KM/Y# 183a, CV $350 in EF.

The lower one (No. 1) I found listed under Kwangtung province in the 19th century Krause; it's picture is printed with the "patterns", but it doesn't say what it's a "pattern" of. It appears to be a ½ tael; here on Zeno.ru is a somewhat shoddier example, denounced as fake.

The lower one is almost certainly fake, as real ones are either excessively scarce or don't actually exist. The top one looks very similar in fabric to it; if they came from the same source, doubt them both.

Thanks for the info Sap and Bob. Bob they are scans so the color tone will be off they do actually have luster

G'day, I've been to PR China several times. I've seen quite a few coins of these and similar varieties. Sometimes, I have seen US & UK " Trade dollars". They are invariably well-struck, with far too much detail, I think, to have been cast.
As one walks around of an evening, vendors emerge, to display their goods on a blanket spread on the footpath. These coins, "jewellery" for little girls, relics of the Mao-era, and cigarette lighters are most of their stock.
There are at least a dozen patterns of such coins on sale. In the course of a week, one can see hundreds of them - with no sign of having been through circulation. Prices start at US$1, and go as high as the seller thinks you might pay. All of which makes me suspect that they are not genuine.
I've handled quite a few. My observations of them are - consistently -
the weight is readily discernable to be a lot lighter than I expect. These are crown-size coins, so I'd expect them to be 25~30 grams. Most are no more than 15g.
the coins are thinner than I expect coins of that diameter.
the coins are usually coated in some oily substance, and are separated by very thin sheets of plastic. I suspect that the oil is to prevent corrosion, and the plastic to prevent damage. But it is all so uniformly applied, that it gives the coins the appearance of just having left the factory.
Occasionally, one sees coins with a look and sheen of real silver. The asking price of these started much higher. These might be genuine, or they might be "superior copies".
The only coin I bought in China was a beautiful British Britannia-penny, bearing date 1907, with a type-1 QE2 obverse, and a silver finish. The moment that I, a foreigner, showed interest, the vendor was excited, and asked US$100, because it was "pure silver". Through my guide, I replied that H.M. was not born until 1926. Guide then harangued him for dishonesty, which drew a small crowd. Vendor very embarrassed. I offered US$1 - my guide objected - because it was such a bad forgery, it was worth keeping. My offer was accepted.
A week later, in a big market in Beijing, I saw another 1907-QE2 mule. Asking price was again US$100, but this bloke wouldn't budge. When told that QE2 wasn't born until 1926, he replied that that fact proved how rare such a "mistake" must be, and he wanted US $1000.
Anyway, I can't say whether the coins inder discussion at the start of this thread are genuine, but I wouldn't pay above US$1, unless a real expert verified them.
Peter in Oz

G'day Swamperbob, if your friend has time to spare in HK, he might catch a train for 40 minutes, and cross over into Shenzen, which is part of PRC-proper. It's not quite like stepping into another world, but it's a big contrast to HK. The problem is that everyone in HK & Shenzen wants to be a millionaire, and right now. And they seem to me to not have many scruples about it. To see the real China, you need to venture a bit deeper. But your friend won't have difficulty finding coins of these types, but warn him not to pay too much.
Peter in Oz

Peter THOMAS I have told my friend that my limit is $3 for non-silver types but that I will go to $3 over melt for silver counterfeits. He has my want list - and I told him to buy anything that is really ODD.

chrycopaul I 100% agree that avoiding Chinese coins will save you money. However, you also need to look at as many of these as possible so that you can tell the fakes from the real ones. This is because there are crooks in other countries too. They will try to pass the coins along at a profit with NO WARNING they are fakes.

great chinese coins scoutjim, I love graphism !

Okay here we go the

1) is approx 40 MM, and the weight is 306 grains, 12.7 dwt, 19.8 grams, .700 OZ

2) the weight is .700 oz, 308 grains, and 12.8 dwt and 20 grams. and is approx 40 MM

are these evn close, I am working on some rim pictures of the area that I believe is most noticable 9 I believ it was a ring die that they used