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Grading Service Dilema

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magusxxx's Avatar
United States
306 Posts
 Posted 06/28/2007  01:05 am Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add magusxxx to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
There's a coin I've found that I'm really interested in. The problem is that I've been told be a friend that I should only get slabbed coins from PCGS and ANAC. This one is an ICG 1886 Morgan dollar graded as MS65. Since the grade is so high I'm slightly worried about getting it only to find out it may be a 64 or even *gasp* a 63. The only thing I can see wrong with the coin is that there is a slight brown color at the top. Any help appreciated.

***Edited by Forum Mom to move to TPG section***
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yechi7's Avatar
United States
717 Posts
 Posted 06/28/2007  01:18 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add yechi7 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I trust ICG. I have found them to even be a little more conservative in their grading than the other TPGs.
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USArmyParatrooper's Avatar
United States
1283 Posts
 Posted 06/28/2007  01:57 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add USArmyParatrooper to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
There's another trusted TPG, NGC. Generally the order (of reputation) goes 1: PCGS, 2: NGC, 3: ANACS.

If it's in any other holder I pretty much consider the coin raw, although I'm not saying that's necessarily fair. I just follow the market.
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yechi7's Avatar
United States
717 Posts
 Posted 06/28/2007  02:28 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add yechi7 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
quote:
Generally the order (of reputation) goes 1: PCGS, 2: NGC, 3: ANACS.


I've seen several reviewers rate:

1: PCGS, 2: NGC, 3: ICG, 4: ANACS.
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SeatedNut's Avatar
United States
2797 Posts
 Posted 06/28/2007  08:50 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add SeatedNut to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Magusxxx,

ICG is lower than ANACS on 20th Century coinage but surpasses them on 19th Century. Their 19th Century grades are conservative so I believe you'd be safe with their grade on the '86 Morgan.

Next question ... have you viewed the coin? If so, how does it look to you?
Edited by SeatedNut
06/28/2007 08:51 am
Valued Member
United States
280 Posts
 Posted 06/28/2007  09:02 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add gatzdon to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I thought ANACS strong point was error coins, attributes, and the fact that they will at least verify authenticity on problem coins.

If a coin was slabbed by ICG, that's not a reason to avoid the coin. If it's an online auction, ask for better pictures.
Forum Mom
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Susanlynn9's Avatar
United States
5877 Posts
 Posted 06/28/2007  09:56 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Susanlynn9 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I have recently started submitting coins to ICG and have been pleased with the grades, including the two Roosevelt dimes I submitted. As you all know, I tend to grade conservatively and I don't market grade. I intend to continue to submit to them and I love their slabs.

ANACS and ICG have been competing for the 3rd spot in the TPG ratings for a while. Quite frankly, these days I'm not very happy with what I see coming out of NGC. Just take a look at my 2007 Washington Dollar Error thread which shows a coin graded by NGC as MS64 when it didn't really even make 63 in my opinion due to the multitude of bag marks.

I would feel comfortable with any older coin graded by ICG. A modern coin graded by them currently should be okay, too.

In considering the coin you want to purchase, I always believe in grading the coin for yourself when possible, but I think you'll be fine with the ICG grade. I know of some ICG coins that have upgraded when crossed over to PCGS or NGC. The brown color you see at the top of the coin is toning and, depending upon how it looks, can be considered desirable. There are a lot of collectors who like toned coins.

Hope this helps.
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yechi7's Avatar
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717 Posts
 Posted 06/28/2007  10:51 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add yechi7 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
quote:
I thought ANACS strong point was error coins, attributes


From ICG's website:

ICG's expertise with errors enabled it to become the "Official Grading Service of CONECA (Combined Organizations of Numismatic Error Collectors of America). CONECA, the world's largest organization of error collectors, approached ICG about a partnership because they were noticing too many error coins being mis-attributed by other services. CONECA's motivation was simply to correct the situation and we were honored they asked ICG to join them. It is a professional partnership, not a financial one, another area ICG considers good ethics for the industry.
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SsuperDdave's Avatar
United States
23522 Posts
 Posted 06/28/2007  12:04 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add SsuperDdave to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
There was a hilarious thread on another forum a while back, about a guy who attempted to submit something to ICG that they wouldn't attribute and grade. He submitted medals, tokens, just about anything metal that he could find. He sent in stuff which he had no clue about the identity of. In all cases, ICG identified, attributed and slabbed them. He finally got his way by submitting wooden nickels - ICG drew the line there.
Valued Member
United States
280 Posts
 Posted 06/28/2007  12:21 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add gatzdon to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I thought in the ICG / CONECA relationship, that ICG graded the coins, and CONECA attributed the coins. I also thought that you had to submit the coins through CONECA to get this.

Does anyone know if ICG puts the CONECA attributions on the slab, or does the graded coin come with a CONECA certificate to accompany the slab.
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yechi7's Avatar
United States
717 Posts
 Posted 06/28/2007  12:31 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add yechi7 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
quote:
I thought in the ICG / CONECA relationship, that ICG graded the coins, and CONECA attributed the coins. I also thought that you had to submit the coins through CONECA to get this.

Does anyone know if ICG puts the CONECA attributions on the slab, or does the graded coin come with a CONECA certificate to accompany the slab.



If you submit your varieties and minting errors directly to ICG, they will not come back with CONECA Numbers or Certificates.

You can submit your varieties and minting errors directly to CONECA and receive the official CONECA Number for your variety or the official CONECA Description for your error coin. CONECA will then overnight the coins to ICG to be graded and encapsulated. The CONECA Number or Description will be included on the ICG grading label.

http://www.icgcoin.com/Default.aspx?tabid=1037

When I submitted my Washington Smooth Edge Dollar Coins, I submitted directly to ICG, since I didn't want to have any additional delay.
Valued Member
lonnie's Avatar
United States
250 Posts
 Posted 06/28/2007  2:59 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add lonnie to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I actually prefer ICG on Roosevelt dimes. They have been the most consistent in my opinion. I also like ANACS simply because they actually do have stricter guidelines on their grading standards, especially on FBL Franklins and FT Roosevelts. I have seen a lot of inconsistent grades and desginations from PCGS and ANACS.

Bottom line as always, buy the coin, not the holder. Know your game.I have bought many slabbed coins over the years from at least 15 or 20 different slabbers, not because of the holder, but the coin itself. My success rate has been extremely good on getting crossovers slabbed at equal and in some cases higher, especially on FBL and FT designations.

Have a great day!!
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magusxxx's Avatar
United States
306 Posts
 Posted 06/28/2007  5:57 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add magusxxx to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Here's the image from their website. They're selling it for $100 which is half of book value. That's why I'm a little worried that something may be wrong with it. It looks like a reputable site. But I'm keeping hush about where it is so you whipper-snappers don't jump my claim.

Grading-Service-Dilema
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Prethen's Avatar
United States
3234 Posts
 Posted 06/29/2007  11:32 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Prethen to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Thumbs up for ICG!
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PBCoins's Avatar
United States
102 Posts
 Posted 07/08/2007  3:51 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add PBCoins to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
If your not sure it will grade at PCGS in 65 bid up to the PCGS 63 current sales prices. Use ebay or Heritage sales, not the coin guide prices on the PCGS website.
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kenny_1745's Avatar
United States
239 Posts
 Posted 07/20/2007  9:15 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add kenny_1745 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
You can trust PCGS, NGC, ANACS, and ICG
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