DD Or MD Software To Show The Difference, Could It Be ?

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Author	Replies: 10 / Views: 1,425
Cobia Valued Member United States 122 Posts	Posted 02/24/2014 1:45 pm The proof is in the pudding, just look at the pics. I know this is not a 100% professional or a guaranteed way to know if it is Double Die or Machine Doubling. The other day I posted a 1958 Penny on here ( original post https://goccf.com/t/170706 ) that I would have bet my paycheck to a cracker that it was a Double Die (lol, I don't work, I ‘m a stay at home dad for 5 years now, Metal Detecting is my thing). Coop, a very awesome member here on CCF, took the time to post some pics and explain the difference. Which for as long as he has been posting and a member here I am not surprised he has not gone postal because from what I am reading he does this on a daily basis and one would think he would be squeezing his keyboard so hard it would snap in half, after explaining things over and over. Feeling frustrated by trying to see and understand the difference between a DD and MD. I started trying different software program for editing pictures. I was looking for something that might help a new person like myself to pick out the difference a little bit easier. Last night just messing around I hit a button and little defined black lines starting showing up on 95% of my coins that are being tagged as MD. So I tested this by using the pics from my original post (Right click, save as, very low DPI when it is done this way) and again tested this with the original one I scanned in. The outcome was the same. So then I surfed around and tested with a few other pics of the internet where other people thought they had a Double Die coin, then others would post that they thought it was not a double die etc... Again about 95% of the time the outcome was the same, little black lines on MD coins. 95% or more of the time when I edit a pic that has been tagged MD the software shows a defined black lines in the areas in question. But when I edit a pic that has been tagged Double Die for the most part there are no defined black lines in the area in question. Sorry I got long winded here but wanted to explain it some. By the few post I have made here on CCF one can tell pretty quickly I am very new to all this and I cannot tell the difference between MD and DD. Just like with everything in like I would think that in time and gained experience one would be able to spot the difference from across the room. Like I said I know this is not a 100% guaranteed but seems to be a huge help... So challenge me, post a coin or two and do not tag it as DD or MD and let me see if I can really show the proof is in the pudding ? Edited by Cobia 02/24/2014 2:30 pm Report this Post to the Staff

coop Bedrock of the Community United States 62064 Posts	Posted 02/24/2014 2:48 pm Ok. Here is one: Report this Post to the Staff
Cobia Valued Member United States 122 Posts	Posted 02/24/2014 3:09 pm Double Die ? Report this Post to the Staff
coop Bedrock of the Community United States 62064 Posts	Posted 02/24/2014 3:12 pm Correct. The first clue is the Dots on the EPU. They are egg shaped instead of round. letters are taller/wider and rounded, not flat shelf like. Next one: Edited by coop 02/24/2014 3:13 pm Report this Post to the Staff
Cobia Valued Member United States 122 Posts	Posted 02/24/2014 3:39 pm I want to say both MD and DD are present on this one. This is why, by your picture to me the MD is clearly present (low and flat). But then if my theory holds water then by the picture I posted double die markings is also present. There for leading my to think both are present. Edited by Cobia 02/24/2014 4:06 pm Report this Post to the Staff
SsuperDdave Moderator United States 23522 Posts	Posted 02/24/2014 8:57 pm I'm not trying to belittle your efforts, but the difference between DD and MD is a relatively easily developed skill which experienced collectors can do, by eye, with near-100% accuracy. All it requires is a little precision in thought process, divorcing yourself from subjective thinking about what you're looking at. With the technique you've developed, you already demonstrate the requisite intellectual orientation. Just do the requisite learning, and you won't have to depend on a machine to think for you. Report this Post to the Staff
coop Bedrock of the Community United States 62064 Posts	Posted 02/24/2014 10:01 pm It is just Machine Doubling. Note the flat shelf like appearance on the left side of the devices. The overall size of the devices are reduced. Not enlarged as the first image I posted. Report this Post to the Staff
Cobia Valued Member United States 122 Posts	Posted 02/24/2014 10:21 pm @ Coop: LOL, Wel I was half right... Guess that is why I gave myself that 5% fudge factor. I was thinking to hard with it I guess, thought you might be trying to trick me. Well nothing is full proof other then experience but this seems to be helping learn more I guess. @ SsuperDdave: Thanks for the input, that was about the polities way anyone could tell someone to stop trying to reinvent the wheel and get back to work... Greatly appreciated.. Report this Post to the Staff
coop Bedrock of the Community United States 62064 Posts	Posted 02/25/2014 12:46 pm Seems like you editing process will show the shelf like edges, but when it comes to contour of a doubled die, where the light should bend, it makes an edge there. So it may not be the answer you are looking for to tell the difference. I'm thinking you should look at the unedited images and see if the edge is flat like (machine doubled as it is damaged) or rounded (enlarged devices) which is a doubled die. Report this Post to the Staff
rupester Pillar of the Community United States 1300 Posts	Posted 02/25/2014 10:12 pm This is fun... I like to see new ideas sure Coop enjoys this as much as well!! Edited by rupester 02/25/2014 10:16 pm Report this Post to the Staff
Rackster Pillar of the Community United States 4809 Posts	Posted 02/26/2014 07:52 am I didn't expect to see a thread with software validation in it...but why not. A wise man once noted that we are a society drowning in a sea of gadgets. While automated processes and inspection have their places, sometimes all that is needed is a trained, qualified person. Interesting challenge here nonetheless. I enjoy collecting the bits of information members offer up and putting them to test and practice. I also appreciate the comment regarding Coop tirelessly offering explanations - without a doubt subject matter is repeated with the members that come and go. A better Search engine might abate some of the redundancy, but then again, a member would need to use it to make a reasonable impact. I moderated forums long ago and can state that despite best efforts and the promotion of best practices (using a Search), we will always have to rely on the good natures of subject matter experts like Coop, SsuperDave, and Jbuck (to mention a few). Learning should be fun and learning from folks with passion and knowledge makes it even more productive. (going back to my desk to see what comes up next) Report this Post to the Staff
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