Collapse Of The Rare Coin Company

no ..... impact at all most of the good stuff has been swallowed up by self managed superfund that were starved of good items to invest in.as these types of companys needed super funds investing and the coins and note seem to be held longer so you get a drought ... the collector stuff has come down a little as most have to much hype and the new collector like my boys and there friend are not buying predecimal coins or don't collect pre decimal as they have not had it in there hands or seen it the self managed super funds I think have helped prices on rarities

Great time to be a buyer then.

If that is a drama for anyone then IMHO the purchases were Ill informed or for all the wrong reasons.
The trouble with companies like the Rare Coin company is they encourage greed and it NOT only inflates the market, It also discourages other collectors and investors in the future .
There were a lot of people "Burnt" with this company and it has "Soured" the market.
From its inception this companies promises of X amount of profit were unsustainable and just plain BS.
In reality I very much doubt that any "Informed" collectors would have used them.
In reality they were after the Mom and Pop type investors and they prayed on them.
Simply put this Mob were Dodgy slimy S.O.B's and None of them will loose any of their assets Despite destroying the retirement hopes of many an investor
End of rant , Now I have to go outside and spit this Bad taste out of my mouth.

To me, this is part correlation, part causation. The business model used by these companies assumed that prices for rare coins and notes would just keep going up and up. Just like a Ponzi scheme or the property bubble a few years ago. Prices can trend generally upwards, but there can be and, if you wait long enough, certainly will be downturns. A business unprepared for and in denial of the possibility of downturns is vulnerable. That's the correlation: prices for items went down even before those companies collapse and indeed the downturn helped cause the companies to collapse.

The causation is, of course, the fire-sale dumping of a large number of items onto a market that was already coasting downhill. It had the effect of letting go of the brakes, sending prices falling faster.

Sorry to hear about your losses you may not have a claim to money (believe Westpac has priority as it loaned them money and as such the company assets were most likely used as collateral for the loan so shareholders and clients wont get all their money back) but you may still have a claim to the items so you can hold on to these it may take a while but they will increase in price.

This situation really is just a smaller sort of bubble with the rare coin company to put it in Economics terms the guarantee they gave served to entice people to purchase increasing the demand while the supply always remains constant while when the rare coin company couldn't pay the guarantees people unloaded meaning supply would heavily outweigh demand lowering prices accordingly. The thing is they guaranteed around 13% (correct me if I am wrong on that figure) increase in value every year which is absolutely massive considering that with any investment we all know the market has ups and downs that is why on almost all investment brochures they state that past performance is no indicator of future performance.

Now on ANDA I myself am highly critical of it particularly concerning some infamously shady members but there are also absolutely fabulous members of ANDA such as Eric Eigner of Drake Sterling etc. However your criticism Gandalf on regulating prices is completely unjustified and erroneous as there are rights of merchants to have freedom in setting the prices of their goods (covered in the constitution.)Also the criticism on prices is further proven unjustified as a good is only worth what someone is willing to pay for that good and if someone is willing to pay a higher price for it then it isn't inflated as the higher price is supported by demand.

We are not spouting uninformed opinions but cold hard facts and these facts which we have been provided are more than extensive enough to deduce why the collapse of the rare coin company happened and in short it was that they offered guarantees too high for the market which led to large demand (provided not only internally within the coin collecting community but quite heavily externally through speculators and investors) but when the time came to sell the items hadn't appreciated as much as was needed so they had to pay out the difference as that goes on they steadily lose money which was accelerated by the increased desire of the clients to sell and the inability to sell off the items that they had bought back from clients (essentially a run on the bank.)

This whole situation really does drive home the message of if it looks to good to be true it most probably is and nothing will teach this like investments for example Enron (look it up it is pretty interesting.)

As a newbie to forums (having tried several with no response) I appreciate the rapid responses to my post - Thank You.

I stand partly corrected (and educated by superior knowledge of others in the field of coin collecting).
However, regarding the logically deduced reasons for the collapse of TRCC I stand by my claim that these are still opinions. Yes, sound opinions based on factual, generalised knowledge, more extensive than my own. But, as is clearly outlined in the forum rules, they must be viewed only as opinions.

One cannot know all the facts pertaining to a failed business without acces to all the company data. This is why we have instruments of law and licensed agencies to deal with such matters.

I have a couple of questions on the following

1. Would you be prepared to help me by naming any or all of the shady members, or direct me to the source of the information that proves they are shady?
Please do not interpret my question as a "smart alec retort". I am genuinely considering using the services of a dealer who happens to be a prominent member of ANDA and I do not wish to be bitten again. I too, have "heard" things about one particular member of ANDA
I am also considering contacting ANDA to ask them what exactly it means, for the investor, to know that a dealer is a member. If it comes to that I need to present facts - not hearsay.

2. I have run several businesses, and still do so, and I fully agree with you that pricing is between the vendor and the buyer and should not be controlled by any outside agency. Therefore I am not sure which part of my first post you have interpreted as a criticism of regulating prices. If you are referring to this

then I guess I should have worded it differently. My apologies. I simply meant that TRCC's proudly stated membership of ANDA did not lead them to be totally honest. I thought that the purpose of belonging to a professional body is to guarantee, without need for further investigation, that the member is a "good guy".

Just goes to show that forum discussion is fraught with misinterpretation and failure to clearly state one's view.

With regard to TRCC's guarantee of growth. I was not personally given a guarantee of any particular %. I did receive a written valuation on the anniversary of my purchase. Starting at 13% for the first year and diminishing to around 5%, depending on the item, over a 4 year period. This did raise some suspicion but I was to stubborn to reconsider my trust in the people of TRCC. They always included a statement that past performance is no guarantee of future performance.

Later when I tried to resell an item, it took over 12 months and still no result, and still I did not heed the warning signs. I am now wiser, after the event, as is often the way we learn. Luckily it's only money! (and at least I still have he goods)

Response to shanew



Thank you for asking my humble opinion. I bought a bank note and some coins. I will publish further details, if asked, but not until after I have located a legitimate, licensed dealer who can reassure me of their current value. I'd like to say that I "invested" around $50k but as it turned out I just "spent" the money - so I have lost a significant amount (for me).

All my property was returned in good order and though I lost money I can still recoup some of it. (Probably enough to refuel the car a few times Ha! Ha!)

My mindset was faulty. It was a decision to put away some money, from cashed-in other types of investments, so that I could grow a bigger profit. The decision was made without proper investigation of the method of investment. I merely compared the interest rates between different investments. Most importantly, in this case, I did not "shop around" to check market values.

I believe that rare coins can be a good investment but you really have to get sound advice (as with any investment) and you must be prepared to have a long term strategy. So if I ever have sufficient excess funds in the future I doubt that I would try rarities again unless I am much better educated in the field by then.

I am not qualified to advise on investing but the following may help...
Some of my business associates, who are more experienced investors, saw this coming but allowed me to be pig-headed and learn the hard way. It may seem strange but that is the only way to learn if you are not prepared to seek advice from the right source. Some of my associates would say...

Don't invest more than you can afford to lose.

Don't rely on only one source of information.

Definitely don't rely on internet based information unless the source of the information is given and traceable to a real, accountable person. Anyone can say anything they want on the 'net and not be held accountable. (from Facebook ravers to forum-posters to multi-billion dollar corporations)

Don't consult "your friend" who has never done anything similar. Friends are for barbecues and fishing and moral support. If a true mate is a pro in the field then he/she could be a very good source of advice.

Be wary of any one who volunteers bad info about someone else in the process of advising you. If they are genuine advisers they don't need to knock the opposition.

Eventually you just have to go and consult face to face with a professional. Even then you must satisfy yourself that his/her credentials are valid.

In the end it's all up to yourself. Whichever course you choose â€" you will learn from it. I sure hope this helps someone not to get bitten like I was.

Thanks Ganalf you seem like a nice guy. To contact me click on the blue name beside my post hat will take you to my profile and just click send an email and off you go.