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Nice Silvered Follis

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bobbyhelmet's Avatar
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2838 Posts
 Posted 10/22/2014  4:35 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add bobbyhelmet to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
Evening all, I've not bought much this year, not found anything that really interested me until recently when there was somewhat of a glut, I've just picked this up.

Sellers picture
Nice-Silvered-Follis
FL VAL CONSTANTIVS NOB C - Bust right, Laureate.
GENIO POPV-LI ROMANI - Genius, naked standing left, modus on head holding patera and cornucopiae
296AD - RIC VI Lugdunum 17a (p243). Size ?mm, Weight ? grams.


Its one of the nicest examples I've seen, its a shame the flan wasn't a little fuller but then I guess that would have bumped the price up somewhat.

My main reason for wanting this coin was that I already own two others from the same die. I was under the impression finding two from the same die in this period was rare? Three has to be, right? Does anyone else have anything like this or any knowledge to share?

Nice-Silvered-Follis


I think the obverse match is pretty clear, the reverses don't seem to match unless a certain amount of retooling has happened, to be honest I've not given them a lot of thought.

I'm seeking info on the minting of my coins if anyone can help, the best source I have found so far is the following by Jere M. Wickens:

http://www2.lawrence.edu/dept/art/B...DUCTION.HTML


Quote:
In ancient coins the lower or obverse die was almost always used to stamp the principal face of the coin, usually depicting the head of a deity or ruler. It was preferable to carve the deeper and more intricate image into the lower die, since it was placed within an anvil and was therefore better protected, wore down less quickly, and suffered less damage than the upper die, which received direct hammer blows during the striking. It should be noted that in general use, the term "obverse" usually designates the principal side of the coin, our "heads," regardless of whether it was made with the lower die.

The number of coins that could be struck from a die before it had to be replaced varied considerably, owing to a number of factors: metal composition, size of coin, and depth of relief. Smaller dies and dies with shallower relief lasted longer. Modern experiments suggest that an obverse die could strike about 15,000 acceptable coins, a reverse die only about half as many. Often, however, more than two reverses were used with an obverse die, since dies were often replaced before they wore out. Ancient dies were also often partially recut or altered, both to repair small flaws or cracks that might develop in the die face and to change or add inscriptions. Sometimes damaged dies continued in use.

The lifespan of dies was dependent on the number of coins struck. Dies at smaller mints were often used for three to five years. In the busy mint of Hellenistic Athens, an obverse lasted for three to five months. And during some peak periods of minting in Roman times, a die might have lasted only 12 hours.


I personally find it mind blowing that all three of the above could have been made within a day or two of each other 1718 years ago
Edited by bobbyhelmet
10/22/2014 4:36 pm
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echizento's Avatar
United States
23731 Posts
 Posted 10/22/2014  4:43 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add echizento to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Hi Bobby it's been awhile. I really like this coin, it has excellent details and is well centered and the silvering is really nice. Congrats on this addition to your collection.
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Ancientnoob's Avatar
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5155 Posts
 Posted 10/22/2014  4:57 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Ancientnoob to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Thats cool BH. Nice Avatar. Under close examination you probably could determine which of the coins is the oldest based on die state.
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 Posted 10/22/2014  5:43 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add FVRIVS RVFVS to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
While I do see very many points of similarity I do notice a very few small differences.
Namely the nose (aquiline vs 'busted') and the front edge of the hair above forehead. The 1st example seems to have a narrower top.
I would have scooped the coin myself had I had a match this close. Most remarkable is when you figure what the output of the Lugdunum mint operation must have been. Being the primary source of payroll for the northern legions it must have employed vast numbers of people and had an impressive daily production. Finding matches really is amazing !
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bobbyhelmet's Avatar
United Kingdom
2838 Posts
 Posted 10/22/2014  6:27 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add bobbyhelmet to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Under close examination you probably could determine which of the coins is the oldest based on die state.



Quote:
Namely the nose (aquiline vs 'busted') and the front edge of the hair above forehead. The 1st example seems to have a narrower top.


You're certainly correct about the nose, its not quite as bad as it looks in my pictures but it is different. Part of it could be die damage over time and part of it could be the way its been harshly scraped clean. The first 'C' in the legend also seems to have been damaged over time. I would guess the silvered coin is the earliest and the middle coin the oldest.

Nice-Silvered-Follis

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chrsmat71's Avatar
United States
4964 Posts
 Posted 10/22/2014  11:55 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add chrsmat71 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
just barely some wear on the high point, great lookin' coin BH...sweet details.
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