| Author |
 Replies: 22 / Views: 10,107 |
|
Valued Member
United States
52 Posts |
Two weeks ago I purchased a 1909S VDB Lincoln at an auction house. Well I sent it to PCGS, checked my submission status today and it says "questionable color RD" sometimes this place drives me nuts, $75 for a no grade. What does this mean? Are they saying it was cleaned or they don't know if it was cleaned? The auction house did not auction this as "cleaned" which they do on a few of their coin.  Any thoughts? Edited by treasurehunter
09/26/2007 11:33 pm
|
|
|
|
Bedrock of the Community
United States
14454 Posts |
means they felt the coin had been cleaned and then treated with something causing a questionable color
|
|
Valued Member
 United States
52 Posts |
I can't find it, but I thought they had separate codes for no grades, and cleaned had it's own category. That's what is confusing me, why not just put cleaned?
|
|
Pillar of the Community
United States
2443 Posts |
They're not very specific about problems. They might also be wrong. Post a picture of it on here and maybe one us can spot the problem.
|
|
Bedrock of the Community
United States
14454 Posts |
I agree, you may be able to send it to ANACS or NGC and get it slabbed and then send it back to PCGS and them slab it also, I have also seen the same coin get body bagged the first time and get slabbed the second at the same TPG |
|
Valued Member
United States
52 Posts |
|
|
Pillar of the Community
Australia
853 Posts |
I do not trust PCGS...I sold a customer a Centenary florin I purchased at auction...auction house did not describe it as cleaned. I had no reason to believe it was cleaned. My customer got it back in a body bag from PCGS as ungraded as it had been cleaned.
If my customer is unhappy I just replace or refund...no questions asked...so my customer is sending it back. But given this experience and other stories I have heard I have my doubts over most grading services. I have all to often coins returned from PCGS as cleaned only to be graded when they have been resubmiited. I have also seen a graded coin busted out of the slab and resubmitted only to be given a higher grade. If this sort of thing can happen how can anyone have any confidence in PCGS or any grading service.
|
|
Bedrock of the Community
United States
14454 Posts |
I am in no way a Lincoln expert but if the red in the third picture is the color of red the coin actually is I have to say it looks a little off to me also but remember this is going by a picture and there are so many variables that can change how the coin looks in hand that this is by no means a definite "Yes it has been cleaned and recolored" answer. The coin looks to have beautiful detail and since it is also a key coin even if the experts say the color looks off I would probably still send the coin to ANACS so it will atleast be authenticated by them instead of all you knowing is it had questionable color and nothing else
Edited by Bryan1315
09/13/2007 1:10 pm
|
|
Valued Member
United States
52 Posts |
The third picture was taken with underlighting, which does not show the true color at all, it is not that red has some brown mixed in. I'll post another of the reverse. Yes I agree about PCGS, I have only sent two coins to them and both have come back ungraded. I guess you have to be tied in or spend a lot of money with them to get the grades. Too political for me! Yes I will send to ANACS as soon as I get the coin back and let you all know what happens. Care to chime in on a grade prior? Love to hear what you think. Image:  19092222.jpg65.89 KB Image: 19092.jpg72.88 KB Image: 190922.jpg85.04 KB Image: 1909222.jpg65.66 KB Edited by treasurehunter
09/13/2007 9:14 pm
|
|
Pillar of the Community
United States
6385 Posts |
Hi Treasurehunter, As I've mentioned in other posts, if PCGS rejects your coin for cleaning or "questionable color" they will not provide any information about authenticity. I agree you should have it slabbed by ANACS, just to to get proof that it is genuine. I'm convinced your coin is OK because it looks like a perfect match for the authentic specimens shown in the PCGS Counterfeit Detection book. The details look very sharp. The color does appears a little odd to me and PCGS may be correct that it is not original. I just think they should throw in an authenticity opinion when they body-bag your key date coin! I would guess ANACS would slab this cent with an "Unc Details, Recolored" description. It is still a great coin with a lot of appeal. By the way, nice work on the photomicrographs! Terrific clarity!  |
|
Valued Member
United States
52 Posts |
Thanks. I hope I'm ok with the genuine part, it does have the die gouge between R&U of trust and the die chip in the upper loop of the S, although I know all that can be copied, so I'm glad you think it OK. I do know of others who have sent coins to PCGS and had them returned as not genuine, so since they make no mention to that and only the color I think I'll be ok. The auction house I bought from has been around quite a long time and I don't think they would sell a fake, but I am disappointed that they did not label this as cleaned.
Yes, ANACS is definitely next.
|
|
Bedrock of the Community
United States
17884 Posts |
Just because the auction house didn't say it was cleaned doesn't mean that it wasn't. Just because PCGS says it was cleaned doesn't mean that it was. People are human and they may look at it once and call it one thing and then look at it again later and call it something else. To many people seem to treat the grading services as if their OPINIONS are Holy Writ handed down from Mount Sinai. Moses brought down the Ten Commandments and the grade on this 1884-S dollar. Sorry it doesn't work like that. If it did there would be no such thing as the crackout game.
Edited by Conder101
09/20/2007 10:27 pm
|
|
Valued Member
United States
287 Posts |
Amen Conder101. Buy the coin! Not the slab! But don't buy it on ebay anymore. |
|
Valued Member
United States
52 Posts |
Well I said I'd update you. I sent the coin to ANACS and just got the results. MS60 cleaned. I'm still happy though, that's the highest grade you can get on problem coins and I do like this coin, so I'm not sure if I'll keep it or sell it yet. Glad to know it genuine. Guess I'll get to see that new holder. Thanks all.
|
|
Rest in Peace
United States
2884 Posts |
Did ANAC'S change the "problem" holders as well as the "regular" holders? I wonder if your coin will come back in a re-designed (different font etc...)problem holder? Mike  |
|
Valued Member
United States
52 Posts |
Good question Mike. I don't know I don't have the coin back yet. I didn't even know they had two different types. I just assumed I'd get the new holder. Now you have me interested. I'll let you know when I get it.
|
| |
Replies: 22 / Views: 10,107 |
Posted 09/12/2007 11:56 pm
1909obv1post.jpg
1909obvtoplight.jpg
1909revunderlight.jpg
1909scloseup.jpg
19092222.jpg
19092.jpg
190922.jpg
1909222.jpg
