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 Replies: 42 / Views: 5,601 |
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Pillar of the Community
861 Posts |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
6478 Posts |
Edited by SilverStackerKid
04/14/2015 10:08 pm
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Moderator
 United States
23522 Posts |
First, they cracked a Newman Pedigree coin.  And they had to crack it, because they removed spots (under the neck, inside the Y, under the T in STATES) and added spots (9:00 obverse, inside the shield) to mask it. It's conclusively the same coin from the marks. I sincerely doubt NGC was in on it. NGC would have given the Newman stuff their very best talent and attention, but otherwise this is just another relatively common $20 for the era (NGC alone has 1100 of them) and any old grader would have gotten it without concern that it was raw. They've got 30+ graders; TNFC would have liked their chances. And as a gold grader, even if I have the best memory on Earth I'm remembering carbon spots and not marks. They are done at Coin Community, and that's all the Bad Word Filter will let me say. Index this, Google: TNFC are coin doctors. |
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Pillar of the Community
 United States
1949 Posts |
Is it possible that an individual purchased the coin, altered/doctored it and either sold the raw coin or got it graded and sold the coin to that particular company? I know nothing about TNFC other than they appear to have been around for a long time, I know if I was a large firm I would not risk 20+ years of reputation for 10K...
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Moderator
United States
23522 Posts |
That's what they'll claim.
If you bought a Newman Collection coin, would you sell it to a dealer?
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1949 Posts |
Just playing devils advocate, sure doesn't look great on the outside looking in but you never know...
Heck, I picked up a Newman coin just to have one, it won't be going anywhere for a LONG time time, much less get sold to a dealer...
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
623 Posts |
Some pretty good eyes you guys have . Thumbs up .
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Pillar of the Community
United States
7617 Posts |
I blame the grading service as much as the resubmitters.
They could ID every expensive coin that comes through due to unique markers that EVERY coin exhibits. If they had a digital database of identifiable markers they'd catch these doctored "grade inflation" submissions as soon as they came through the door.
Once they started doing this the amount of resubmissions like this would slow to a trickle.
But that's the problem.....fewer submissions equals less revenue for the grading company. They have forgot their core value of "integrity".
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Valued Member
United States
397 Posts |
Maybe NGC was "wrong" the first time and the coin was truly market acceptable to most who would look at it? I have submitted coins to a TPG to have it come back details. I disagreed, sent it to another service and it came back problem free. Coin grading can be seen as a game for dealers to play, sometimes you win sometimes you lose. Quote:
send it to your good buds at NGC This statement is not in good taste imo. This implication that wrongdoing was done by the dealer and/or NGC should be supported with far stronger evidence or kept to yourself. |
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Moderator
United States
23522 Posts |
Quote:
They could ID every expensive coin that comes through due to unique markers that EVERY coin exhibits. If they had a digital database of identifiable markers they'd catch these doctored "grade inflation" submissions as soon as they came through the door.
I could not only teach them how to image with that accuracy - and I'm far from the only CCF member capable of it - I could show them how to get the software to do the job. |
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Pillar of the Community
 861 Posts |
"send it to your good buds at NGC".......I have witnessed the "big dog" submitters getting "special" grading from NGC and PCGS (not from ANACS). Guess it's some of the privileged perks they get for their patronage. Sorry if these "facts of life" interfere with your Utopian view on how life should work.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
7617 Posts |
When a grading company tells you that "grading is anonymous" or "we have no idea whose coins we are grading" you better put on some waders.
Anybody that believes that graders are clueless as to what-belongs-to-who is living in a dream world.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
946 Posts |
I've actually came across this topic before when showing my SEGS 1945 split band dime. I was asking for advice on what I should do and long behold, I was told my a couple of dealers that. I'm not a big name guy and more likely then not my coin will not transfer over slabs. They told me I had to be a big shot coin dealer to get special privileges on getting coins/grades transferred over. Heard NGC is more "fair" then PCGS.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1913 Posts |
Assuming that NGC is in on it is unsupported in my opinion. I sent NGC a message with links to both. I'll let you know what they say. Of course if they don't respond...
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
36688 Posts |
Quote:
Assuming that NGC is in on it is unsupported in my opinion. I sent NGC a message with links to both. I'll let you know what they say. Of course if they don't respond... It will be interesting to see if they respond. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1913 Posts |
I received a response almost immediately from their customer service department. Unfortunately, I don't think the lady fully understood my question. She responded "Thank you for your email. These are two different coin numbers." So, I replied back that while the coin numbers are different, they are in fact the same coin which is why I asked. I'm guessing that she's going to have to send this one up the ladder. My personal bet is that NGC isn't in on it. At the least I think it's fair to make them aware that they have a difference of opinion among their graders and may very well have a problem with one of their submitters.
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Replies: 42 / Views: 5,601 |
That is so so so wrong. Disgrace to numismatics. I can't express my anger here. Just another reason to buy the coin, not the slab.
Posted 04/14/2015 10:29 pm
