| Author |
 Replies: 18 / Views: 2,446 |
|
Pillar of the Community
United States
6478 Posts |
As I have been reading a lot of posts about people asking about double dies, I see a lot of people getting it wrong, until a pro gets in to stop it. Well here is the guide to doubling. Memorize this and you are good to go. I hope I helped. That is what I try to do most!  First up is real doubling. You know you have one when you see one. The way to see if you have one is if the devices are slightly, or very noticeably thicker. Split serifs are a great sign too. Dies are made differently now but doubled dies were made when the design was transferred onto the die twice. The 2nd time it is transferred it might be slightly off a little, creating a true doubled die. Here is an example of a very minor doubled die obverse. It is a 1972 S proof clad half dollar.  You can barely see a split serif at the top left corner of the I. Clear Doubling here at the G.  A more obvious example is this.  THE FOLLOWING ARE NOT ERRORS AND ARE VALULESSThe most common things people mistake for doubled dies is either MD, (machine damage) or VLDS, (very late die stage) coins. About MD. MD happens when the die moves during the ejection process. During this process, the die scrapes and flattens the devices, thus creating a flat shelf like line and reducing the devices. The best way to tell if your coin is affected by MD is id the devices are reduced and the "doubling" is lower than the actual devices. MD is not collectable. Here are some examples.     Up next is when a die is overused and in a late die stage. The coins most affected by VLDS are the coins minted during the time that a die is getting ready to retire. As dies mint more and more coins the super heavy heavy heavy pressure used to mint the coins wears down and manipulates the overall shape of the devices. Fields with lines going towards the rim are affected by VLDS.  Thanks to coop!   Special thanks to Jwmurders for this image! Here you can see the devices starting to flow towards the rim.  The thing that makes VLDS distinguishable from MD and double dies is the flow in the fields and the devices towards the rim. The devices will also be distorted. If you feel I need to add some information please feel free to tell me. I really hope this helps the new comers to the hobby. I learned this from watching all of the experts post and I have gained lots of knowledge. I hope this kind of gives back to the forum. If you have any questions feel free to ask and I am sure me or an actual expert will answer.  Edited by SilverStackerKid
05/02/2015 12:22 pm
|
|
|
|
Bedrock of the Community
United States
62064 Posts |
The 1986-P Dime is Machine Doubling on the date. The lines where the arrows are, is striation lines. (lines from the roughness of the metal when moved sideways) You can often see this on devices that are pushed by die movement.  There are die flow lines that are starting on that coin, but they are next to the rim area. |
|
Bedrock of the Community
United States
62064 Posts |
On the machine doubled (damage) image the push of the dies raises some areas above the devices when the die movement pushes again the devices:  This is a proof coin with MD on the devices. I mirrored the image to make is show the raised part of the MD. |
|
Pillar of the Community
 United States
6478 Posts |
Yeah I noticed that after posting. I beleive when I posted that coin people said it was was a VLDS. I will get diff pics
|
|
Bedrock of the Community
United States
62064 Posts |
I thinkg the best example of Machine Doubling and hub doubling is this image:  By Jason Cuvelier. |
|
Pillar of the Community
United States
6478 Posts |
Thank you coop. I really appreciate it. That image you just posted really contributes. Thank you.
Edited by SilverStackerKid
05/02/2015 12:55 am
|
|
Valued Member
United States
297 Posts |
Thank you silver stacker for taking the time to do this for everyone here on CCF.. I always have a problem when it comes to certain coins and trying to distinguish if I am looking at md or dd on certain examples but your simple breakdown makes it definetly easier for the new collectors to understand without having to read a book about it to understand the differences. I thank you for your time doing this.. I usually don't have issues but there are those coins that show both md and dd that really get me  . Props to coop as well for his efforts and all he does along with all the other pro's..We all appreciate your hard work here on the forum. |
|
Pillar of the Community
921 Posts |
what would this fall under? (especially on the "M" and the "#1" & "#6")  |
|
Pillar of the Community
United States
3644 Posts |
Yes we do appreciate it! Priceless help...I any have given up long ago on finding a doubled die if not for this forum-it look me almost a year and a half of hard searching before I found my first true doubled die and 5 more quickly followed and totally renewed my passion! I was told to keep looking I will find and at times had trouble believing I would lol but along the way I also started finding some other awesome errors but it does take time and commitment but I love it,every roll is like a new treasure hunt-I'm in another dry spell lol but that's just fine-good luck and keep searching...
|
|
Moderator
 United States
189046 Posts |
|
|
Pillar of the Community
United States
6478 Posts |
I would say MD aardspeed. Hard to tell from pics.
Thank you Slamnbass! I love to help.
@jbuck I guess this is more detailed and for newer members that may have not been able to find info like this before.
|
|
Moderator
United States
56855 Posts |
SilverStackerKid, Good post. But it's doubled die not double die.If I remember right there are 9 classes of doubled dies known. John1  |
|
Pillar of the Community
United States
6478 Posts |
Are you sure? Because people always say it differently. I will change it. :/
|
|
Bedrock of the Community
United States
62064 Posts |
It is called a doubled die for a reason. When the hub creates a doubled image on the die, we call it a doubled die because the doubling is on the die. Machine Doubling (actually damage to the devices on a coin) is created from a normal die and the machine causes it to damage the coin. Die movement, ejection and probably other events make a coin from a normal die look doubled (damaged) I refer to this often as machine damage on a coin. some call it machine doubling/mechanical doubling/strike doubling/studder strike/and other terms. I call it machine damage/doubling because it came from a machine, not a mechanical. But that is just me. Edited by coop
05/02/2015 1:55 pm
|
|
Moderator
United States
189046 Posts |
Quote:
@jbuck I guess this is more detailed and for newer members that may have not been able to find info like this before. No problem and nothing against your post. I just wanted to make sure you and everyone else had a chance to see that one I keep bookmarked. |
|
Valued Member
United States
290 Posts |
just seen this its great thank for this its what I been needing a lot of answers off to my search hahaha  |
| |
Replies: 18 / Views: 2,446 |
Posted 05/02/2015 12:24 am
