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Silver Percentage US Vs Canadian Dollars

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punman's Avatar
Canada
849 Posts
 Posted 11/14/2015  9:41 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add punman to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
I do not collect U.S. coins but I notice that silver dollars were made up until 1935 and were 90% silver. Interesting that this was the year Canada starting to issue silver dollars but that is not my observation. I see Canada made them 80% silver.

Just curious to why Canada did not follow in the U.S. pattern of 90%. Too expensive? Would not wear as well? Those are just a couple of my theories. I really do not know the answer.
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sel_69l's Avatar
Australia
21786 Posts
 Posted 11/14/2015  11:12 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add sel_69l to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
ASW Cdn $ is 77.6% of the weight of silver in the U.S. Dollar.
By reducing the overall weight a little, and reducing the silver fineness a little, adds up to a big little amount.

Both the overall weight and the fineness are less only by a small amount. Probably done that way for the Cdn dollar to retain most of it's credibility, and not notice the ASW reduction too much.
Besides, the Cdn silver dollar was struck in far fewer numbers, so that the amount od silver required to produce the series was only a small fraction of that required to produce the Peace dollar series.

I think it was just a way of saving some cost on the Canadian Treasury.
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punman's Avatar
Canada
849 Posts
 Posted 11/14/2015  11:52 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add punman to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I don't see the logic about smaller quantity of coins relating to less silver. If anything, the fact that fewer were made in Canada might make one conclude that they could afford to use more silver, not less than the U.S.
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DavidUK's Avatar
United Kingdom
2624 Posts
 Posted 11/15/2015  12:08 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add DavidUK to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
You have to set some sort of standard, and that is the standard they chose.

In the UK coins were 92.5% silver till 1920, then they debased and went with 50% silver till 1947 at which point they removed the silver completely. Gold was removed from circulation in 1933. This didn't matter so much since the currency was still backed by physical gold held in the Bank of England, and was until Gordon Brown (in his wisdom) decided to sell half of the gold reserves at one of the lowest rates possible...and announce the sale ahead of time so that prices could fall further.

I digress. Britain has always held that the standard of British silver should be 925 parts in a 1000 (though a second higher standard did/does exist called Britannia standard, .950) on the other hand some of the continental silver like coins of France were produced at .825.

Some countries produce/produced gold coins in 22ct, and others in fine gold 23.99ct. Silver proofs are produced at different standards too.

Obviously production of coins on a large scale does demand some cost considerations, even meaning the withdrawal of copper in replacement by steel with a copper cladding.

The long and short is that choices need to be made and a bar set at some level and there is no mandatory level it must be set at. This means naturally there have been variations country to country.
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Canada
5585 Posts
 Posted 11/15/2015  05:39 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add okiecoiner to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The .800 dollars made it easy for scrappers ... each dollar had EXACTLY .6 oz of silver
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sel_69l's Avatar
Australia
21786 Posts
 Posted 11/15/2015  06:43 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add sel_69l to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
When the decision was made to go to an 800 fine silver standard, the Canadian Treasury at the time were economic rationalists, not coin collectors.

Now, the RCM is perfectly happy to produce 1000 fine silver coins for collectors.
If you wanna buy 'em complete with a profit margin for the Canadian People, then the RCM is happy to make 'em, and market 'em to you.

Most of the RCM's coin collector products are of leading World standard.
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kbbpll's Avatar
United States
4233 Posts
 Posted 11/15/2015  12:27 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add kbbpll to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
As far as I can tell, up to 1920 all Canadian silver was .925, and 1920+ everything switched to .800. The introduction of the dollar as .800 was just sticking with their standard. So maybe the question is why they changed in 1920.
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kuh_85's Avatar
Canada
2366 Posts
 Posted 11/15/2015  8:17 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add kuh_85 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
So maybe the question is why they changed in 1920.


Inflation. The silver in the coins was becoming more valuable than the face value.
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punman's Avatar
Canada
849 Posts
 Posted 11/15/2015  10:08 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add punman to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Thanks for all the comments. Kbbpll - your answer makes sense. That is what all the other silver coins were in 1935 - 80% silver.
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kbbpll's Avatar
United States
4233 Posts
 Posted 11/15/2015  10:35 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add kbbpll to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
"Inflation" as a reason makes my head spin, which is probably why I dropped out of my college Economics class. Their money became more valuable than their money, so they had to make their money less valuable. (head explodes)
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Pacificoin's Avatar
Canada
5394 Posts
 Posted 11/15/2015  10:38 pm  Show Profile   Check Pacificoin's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add Pacificoin to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The reason sterling silver standard was debased to .800 fine was due to World War 1 more than anything else. Just like Great Britain ,Canada accumulated massive war debt and it was a way to help pay for it. Purely economic.
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Alexer's Avatar
Canada
2632 Posts
 Posted 11/15/2015  10:58 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Alexer to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I think Pacificoin hit it right on the head, World war 1. Canada's population was only about 8 or 9 million around then. Purely economic would make sense to me.
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trout1105's Avatar
Australia
7096 Posts
 Posted 11/15/2015  11:12 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add trout1105 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Regardless of their silver content I am of the opinion that the Canadian Silver dollars are an underrated coin due to their low mintages compared to their US counterparts.

I do have some Morgan's and Peace dollars But I have Many Canadian silver dollars simply because I prefer them
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Canada
2845 Posts
 Posted 11/15/2015  11:28 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add wildflowerAB to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Blame the Americans! So it is written, seriously! My reference is Striking Impressions by Dr James Haxby. With low silver prices Canada made 65c on every $1 worth of silver coinage produced. Meanwhile opportunist parties in the US were exporting Cdn coin "with tacit approval of the Cdn govt" to sell to the Oriental market for melt. But demand for coin within Canada increased and by late 1919 it was costing more than $1 to replace every $1 worth of silver coin that was melted. So in 1920 the silver content was reduced to 80% and the 5c replaced with nickel.
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Canada
1984 Posts
 Posted 11/15/2015  11:55 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Smallcentguy to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Here is an article on the silver price spike of 1919. No doubt a key factor on the decision to debase in 1920. Still, with silver at $1.34 in 1919, the bullion value in a Canadian coin was well under face.

http://www.321gold.com/editorials/w...n041105.html
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Canada
2845 Posts
 Posted 11/16/2015  12:52 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add wildflowerAB to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
My quick calculation is not well under face.

For example a 50c piece weighed 11.62 grams = .41 oz

92.5% silver = .38 oz silver content

Silver price at $1.34/oz X .38 oz = 51c of silver per each 50c piece (in addition to production costs to mint).

Indeed at 1919 silver prices, 92.5% content, coin minted would be at a loss, assuming my calculations are correct.
Edited by wildflowerAB
11/16/2015 12:55 am
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