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Oregon Commem And Buying Cleaned Coins

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one_fine_dime's Avatar
United States
591 Posts
 Posted 01/29/2016  4:24 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add one_fine_dime to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
How about this one: http://r.ebay.com/FTygLa
Do folks believe it would come back from a TPG as "Details - Improperly Cleaned"? I see dark toning all around the edge of the Native American chief and in other crevices, which suggest cleaning to me. However, I also see what looks like patina in places (i.e., not just solid blast white that one would expect from dipping).
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one_fine_dime's Avatar
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591 Posts
 Posted 01/29/2016  4:46 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add one_fine_dime to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Ok, I put the Lithuanian's coin next to one from PCGS coin facts (MS67+). Now although the grades are way different, I do notice something odd in the tail of the number 2. The edge of the bottom line seems to extend farther to the right in the PCGS coin than in the Lithuanian's. I think I see what moxking is referring to here as well (i.e., fatter font on the date numbers), but wouldn't one expect that due to wear (i.e., flattening out of lettering)?

Oregon-Commem-And-Buying-Cleaned-Coins
Edited by one_fine_dime
01/29/2016 4:48 pm
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KenKat's Avatar
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4085 Posts
 Posted 01/29/2016  5:10 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add KenKat to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I am not sure I would agree that the first coin in the original post was cleaned. It has some spotted toning which decreases its appeal somewhat, but it still retains some nice luster as far as I can tell. Not all coins tone in desirable ways.

I still prefer it to the second AU details coin personally. The second coin has zero luster based on the pictures. Not attractive to me at least.

That said, in the interest of full disclosure, the Oregon in my 7070 has been (I am pretty sure) artificially toned to give it a highlighted look. I like it and consider it a type of folk art, but others probably see it as not original. To each his own as they say.
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moxking's Avatar
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17900 Posts
 Posted 01/29/2016  7:00 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add moxking to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
one_fine_dime - you already did what I would have suggested, which was to place the fake next to a known authentic example. Since the fake photos are so unclear I can't pick out the most common tell on cast counterfeits, which are raised dots or marks above the fields (most commonly). This happens during the relief process from the original coin.

Everything is thicker on a cast counterfeit, not just the dates or words, but the dates or words are usually the easiest to detect as enlarged. Note any detail and your comparison will show the 'fatness' of everything which also "squishes out" those small details.
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 Posted 02/26/2016  04:16 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Brushy Bandit to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Informative thread guys thank ya. I see the difference in detail when placed side by side. I'm afraid I'd be in trouble without the comparison, tho. Looks like only slabbed for me until I learn the gift.
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 Posted 03/04/2016  08:22 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add freddo30 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Oregon Trail coins are a wonderful testimony to the great artistic couple of James and Laura Fraser. Caution must be utilized as the various date/mint combinations possess enough differences between them to cause confusion in expectations and therefore grading either numeric or subjective.
For luster and superb toning, it is difficult to beat the 1926-s.
For duller and somewhat lifeless surfaces, the 1939-P comes to mind first with the 1938-P often the least attractive of the 1938-PDS set. Of course, like every rule, there are exceptions but I think it's generally as I've indicated.
The plethora of original packaging has contributed to abuse at the hands of the uninformed and cleaned or lightly circulated coins are rampant. Sulfur can be a great toning agent or the angel of death depending on the thickness of silver sulfoxide and the coin's surface type.

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