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 Replies: 26 / Views: 3,054 |
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New Member
Singapore
7 Posts |
Hi Can anyone tell me whether this coin is genuine? It pass the magnet test and the weight is 27grams.   |
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Bedrock of the Community
Australia
21788 Posts |
Surface texture suggests cast fake.
I think the chop marks are fake as well, to help prove the 'authenticity' of this piece.
How sharp and even is the edge milling?
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1915 Posts |
Just glancing at the pictures it looks like a really poor cast fake.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
5362 Posts |
You should definitely check the edge for confirmation but I believe the first responders are correct - the coin is a recently made cast forgery. I doubt it was made a s a circulating counterfeit when this coin was monetized.
The magnet test only eliminates iron and nickel generally. The SG would be far better to tell what the coin is made of.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1915 Posts |
I wonder if the OP can tell us the diameter and thickness in millimeters? Maybe the coin a little too big one way or the other since it's apparently not the typical 17 to 20 grams or so.
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New Member
 Singapore
7 Posts |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1915 Posts |
Surprised it looks so close to the correct size. I thought for sure it would be 3mm thick at least or maybe over 40mm diameter That means to me I think the makers used more dense alloy than I normally find to keep the size about right. You could do well by learning more about different kinds of magnets and how much more useful they can be to detect false or genuine silver coins. In your case it just might be true that the makers used silver. Or maybe you really have a beat up legitimate coin. I have a couple myself where the counterfeiters used silver. By the way, I wouldn't mind having a coin like that myself simply because it doesn't seem to be like most others being so close to the right size and weight. Also the first picture posted makes the letters E in candareens look really bad, but they don't look as bad in your close up with the tape measure.
Edited by Albert
02/25/2016 4:10 pm
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Pillar of the Community
United States
5362 Posts |
The edge next to the ruler actually looks pretty good to me. The other edge photo is out of focus. If you are using an auto focus camera you need to keep the focal plane even to allow the reeds to be in focus. Your fingers are what the camera is focusing on. The camera will have a range (depth of focus) where the image is acceptably clear. As long as the focal plane is close to the uppermost portion of the edge the rim will be in focus. You could try taking a stack of 2x2 holders wrapped with an elastic band. Then insert the coin into the stack and push it down until the top is 1-2 mm above the top of the stack. In this way the flat surface of the top of the stack is what the camera will focus on. In the sketch below the rounded fingers will cause the camera to have some difficulty picking up the correct plane.  |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1915 Posts |
You know, I've been looking more and more at this coin and I just have to wonder. There are elements about it that look pretty right. And it's easy for me to glance at a poor picture and suspect it's a fake coin. That seems to be my norm. I'd ask the OP to somehow produce quality pictures and more accurate measures. But ideally (for me) I wish the guy would put it on ebay. I'd have my associate (buyer) get it. Then when it's in my hands, I'd report here just what it is or is not. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
5362 Posts |
Sometimes a gem is hidden behind poor pictures but most often it is just a poor coin. Before jumping in with both feet press on getting better details. When ebay had a Committee we would have removed the auction with no prejudice until the seller took better pictures. It was a rule we could use to force sellers of "suspect" material to post clear pictures or go away. It is another rule ebay currently does NOTHING AT ALL TO ENFORCE. |
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Bedrock of the Community
Australia
21788 Posts |
36% copper, 9% nickel, 55% lead will yield an alloy of the same density
as an alloy of 90% silver, 10 % copper.
Add a little silver plating to the cast coin.
Should yield a fake of exactly the same thickness, diameter and density as a genuine .900 silver coin, but with no silver.
That is what I am suspecting in this case.
Edited by sel_69l
02/26/2016 05:24 am
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Pillar of the Community
United States
5362 Posts |
sel_69l - The large amount of lead would make the coin ring very poorly and if it was cast it would not ring at all.
When a coin was hollowed out to steal the silver the plug used to replace the core was a cast plug composed of tin and lead. That also did not ring.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1915 Posts |
I agree. Sure could be true. And the 9% nickel can certainly be easily detected but possibly not by the average Joe.
I was just thinking out loud to myself. Has any maker of these coins posted images of their concoctions just to get some feedback on how plausible it would be to pass of their goods? I'm not saying that about the OP. It just struck me that the makers and fakers of these items could exploit resources like this forum to see how well they are doing by asking for opinions about their products. Interesting idea about these kinds of posts anyway. I'm a newbie here, but I have to think members that are more experienced may have contemplated this line of thought.
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New Member
Singapore
7 Posts |
My dad claim he bought this coin about 30 years back.
So if this coin is made by silver does that mean it is genuine?
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1915 Posts |
I think this present rash of fakes coming in from Singapore and China imitating coins like yours is a bit more recent. So if your dad bought this coin 30 years ago that tells me it is certainly worth looking more into it to get a better idea than I can give in this forum. Your coin falls into a different category for me. And that is I would want to see it in my lab and go from there.
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Bedrock of the Community
Australia
21788 Posts |
I believe that the Chinese have made quite a lot of poor quality silver fakes that could also yield close to the same density of that of a genuine 90% silver coin.
An alloy of 60% lead, 40% copper will yield an alloy of 10.4 g/cc. This mixture, alloyed with any amount of silver will give the same density. A ring tone can be achieved, if enough silver is used.
Edited by sel_69l
02/26/2016 05:21 am
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Replies: 26 / Views: 3,054 |
Posted 02/24/2016 12:15 pm
