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Swamperbob Got A New Counterfeit From A Dealer.

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Spence's Avatar
United States
34425 Posts
 Posted 03/17/2016  6:35 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Spence to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
spence You are basically correct


You just made my day! Thanks for posting this topic.
"If you climb a good tree, you get a push."
-----Ghanaian proverb

"The danger we all now face is distinguishing between what is authentic and what is performed."
-----King Adz
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swamperbob's Avatar
United States
5362 Posts
 Posted 03/17/2016  9:47 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add swamperbob to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
jamiep You ask a good question:


Quote:
I was wondering if the ring(sound) of a Sheffield Plate coin would be that of a pure silver coin.


The answer depends on how close to perfect pitch you are blessed with. A hot fused Sheffield plate will ring very well and can easily be confused with the real thing. I suspect the frequency has to be somewhere between silver and copper, but I can not discern a difference.

There are Cold fused Sheffield plates which do not ring well at all. These were made by cold rolling the three layers together. They are often encountered partially detached.

Canadian-Banknotes
VAM identification would of course work provided the coin is not a forgery made from an original coin. I try never to focus on the details on the die until I rule out all of the transfer methods that can be used to duplicate a genuine coin and I establish how the coin was actually made. If that all checks out then I would go to VAM.

In this case (1881-S) that extra effort of determining which VAM number this was did not seem worth it. I determined the coin was a strike through in under 1 minute anyway using a binocular microscope.

Sheffield plate is an old technology but if it was used today with an advanced die making technique the results would not be readily detectable unless you used a density check like Specific Gravity to determine the alloy was not solid.
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Tunnioc's Avatar
United States
3179 Posts
 Posted 03/18/2016  11:35 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Tunnioc to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Great post!
Do you have any pics of a real
Sheffield Plate counterfeit Morgan dollar?
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swamperbob's Avatar
United States
5362 Posts
 Posted 03/18/2016  10:40 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add swamperbob to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Tunnioc I wish I could. There are no confirmed examples of a Sheffield Plate Morgan dollar yet discovered. That was one reason I was excited to examine this coin when the dealer called me. He knows that I have been looking for one for years. I have off metal casts and strikes from fantasy to very genuine looking dies. I have electro-plates. I have full weight standard silver counterfeits - but NO Sheffield plate example.

The latest dated example of a Sheffield Plate coin in my collection is an 1895 Mo FM example of Charles IIII. That fantasy date is believed (by me) to be an accurate date of issue. My theory is based on the large number of different fantasy dates that were made. In this group are some numeric combinations that could not possibly represent a switched out date. The 1895 is one such date. Those 4 digits can not be rearranged to produce a correct date for any coin from Mexico City that also had the FM assayer initials. Since there was a Sheffield Plate coin (8R) made in 1895, I have always wondered if I could locate a Morgan dollar. I expect that they should exist.
Edited by swamperbob
03/18/2016 10:49 pm
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