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 Replies: 970 / Views: 83,854 |
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
2845 Posts |
Quote:It's also good to have a winner ever so often, even if it's only a small fractions of RCM offerings. Sure it is, but nobody has the gold coin in hand yet to know how much they like it. It appears to me that at this point the vibes are about having scored a purchase, by buying something that others didn't have the opportunity to do, so it can be flipped to out-of-luck buyers on ebay for a profit. If I was a newcomer-out-of-luck buyer reading this thread, frankly in my opinion the general tone would turn me off because it reeks of......well, greed. |
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
2845 Posts |
Quote:
Like all coins there's a theme, then mintage and price, in this case if the mintage was halved at say 750, it would sell out at 2000.00 in my opinion. There are a lot of 5oz. gold coins with 200 mintage never sells out due to crappy or over used themes.
Yes, here it is back a reason to like a NCLT is low mintage.....that can also indicate that the particular issue isn't deemed to be very popular by RCM who we know is profit driven and has at their hand gazoodles of marketing stats. I agree with the point that was made earlier on this thread, that 2ndary price appreciation depends on the percentage of an issue that is sold to collectors to add to their collection at issue price, as opposed to the percentage bought up by flippers. People who buy to flip are in competition to one another once the NCLT is added to the secondary market and how quickly they want to sell primarily influences the 2ndary price, more the the number of 2ndary buyers (who are not typically motivated by urgency). So if a high percentage of flippers buy up a new release regardless of the mintage, then secondary value becomes very difficult to predict in my opinion. |
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
5324 Posts |
Just my thoughts again, most high tiered mc don't flip coins, the main reason for the RCM to tier the mc program according to my rep was to weed out the botched BOC gold sale and the massive mc due to the 20 for 20 etc. Lot of retailers rewards loyal customers on volume base, one of the RCM's largest dealer will be one of the largest flipper on this coin based on past performance. |
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
659 Posts |
Quote: Sure it is, but nobody has the gold coin in hand yet to know how much they like it. It appears to me that at this point the vibes are about having scored a purchase, by buying something that others didn't have the opportunity to do, so it can be flipped to out-of-luck buyers on ebay for a profit. If I was a newcomer-out-of-luck buyer reading this thread, frankly in my opinion the general tone would turn me off because it reeks of......well, greed. You're clearly not a Star Trek fan, so you have no idea...and really shouldn't be speculating and commenting on the intentions of fans of this coin. You're making this stuff up in your head. You are wrong. |
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
2845 Posts |
@ Looney4Numi. Wrong about what? The future intentions of Star Trek fans? I have no problem being wrong but speculating on other people's buying habits and how deep their pockets are is just that - speculation.
It's much too early for anyone to be right or wrong, although I can appreciate that some have a greater vested interest in the outcome than others.
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
2428 Posts |
The only ones with a greater vested interest would be dealers and flippers.
We will find out in September as to how many flippers and dealers have this coin.
Personally I think it will be fewer than we think unless crazy money starts getting tossed around for the coin.
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Rest in Peace
Canada
1360 Posts |
chiming in again, the 2013 Superman gold was by far, the most active in recent years on the aftermarket. Sure, I watched superman, but was never a 'super fan' same as were most of my friends. As for Star trek, it was a major part of life as a 60's child and a 70's, 80's, 90's rerun watcher. My parents generation are also fans...so, by the numbers...Who knows which fandom would have deeper pockets - having said that, by the actual numbers, a direct comparison.
Superman Gold 2013
Original Price - $750 (cdn) (compare to 2010 Olympic gold coins $500 - but gold soared after 2010)
Mintage - 2,000
Gold Content - Less than 1/4 ounce (12g @14kt= 6.999g+5g Silver)
Face Value - $75.00 (cdn)
Subject to taxes - yes
Stylized with other weirdness - NO, other than colour aplication
Star Trek $200 Delta coin:
Original price - $1300 ($100 more than a typical $200 annual gold coin)
Mintage - 1,500 (500 less than super man)
Gold Content - 1/2 ounce pure (more than double the Superman coin)
Face Value - $200 (2-2/3 times the fv of Superman)
Subject to taxes - No (but yes in BC as I understand - a 13% savings in Ontario)
Stylized Weirdness - Yes, Delta shape to replicate the Star Trek Insignia
So, hypothetically given the choice of both coins offered at the same time on the same day with equal access to funds to purchase only one of these coins at original price, I would select the Star Trek coin.
Edited by Dcadon
05/15/2016 1:46 pm
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
2845 Posts |
@ Dcadon that's an excellent stastical-based comparison! My only thought, is the buyer market virtually the same for new gold Star Trek coins as the one that's already become Supermaned-out? If it's the same, to those collectors is it just more of generally the same? It's not as if RCM is a Star Trek sole-authorized distributor of Star Trek items and those who don't collect NCLT would have no other options. There's mountains of choices of different themed-based items from jewelry to paper clips to shirts and socks. And is it a tendency for Star Trek fans to buy memorabilia that is visible, can be worn or used? What I mean by that is considering the value of the gold coin, it's likely not something that one would tend to proudly show off to strangers in a public venue. Final point, value is often mentioned -- I wonder, would this coin still be considered a success if it retained it's $1300 issue price in the future? To those who have bought it to add to their collection as a keeper, I'd hope so! Expectations of increased value is clearly what's considered to be investing and for the newer collector, if profit is what motivates them, I don't think it's right for us to encourage expectations about making money. That's the main point that I was trying to make. It sort of remind me of stock forums and "hot tips", one of the oldest trucks in the book. As people buy, based on those "you want to make money, hurry buy this" philosophy, the price increases based on immediate demand. Subsequently the "tipper" is busy selling the hyped stock, meanwhile the new buyers who think they've made a great buy watch their investment quickly deflate thereafter. Buying anything based solely on hype is a lesson of "why not" that most everyone learns st some point in their lives....  |
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
3690 Posts |
I'll just add a couple of things since you guys have hit the high points.
Firstly, would a buyer worry about showing a $1300 coin in public? Maybe, maybe not but they more than likely have a $500-700 phone on their pocket. Many of folks walking around Comic Con this weekend were carrying items worth more than $1300 including cash - though maybe the thought of gold makes owners paranoid and others more likely to commit a crime. I don't know, psychology and behavioural science were never my favourite subjects.
Point is, would I show it around to folks on the bus. Probably not. But would I be afraid to take it to convention or show friends and acquaintances. Probably not.
The second point I would add is not many forum users here are telling others to buy. A few are but they also are often playing both sides and also telling folks to "buy what they like" and "all coins go to melt eventually". If an inexperienced coin collector is reading this forum and getting the message to buy, then I think they are here looking for that answer and some positive encouragement to make a decision they have already made...hey look, some more bad pop psychology.
Point is that all coin collectors make mistakes when they start out (there is a thread about it on here somewhere) whether it is that they buy coins on spec to resell that don't pan out or they buy coins without really appreciating them for what they are or they buy coins because the Mint tells them they are FV currency exchange and they can't lose. In my opinion, there are tons of people who join the hobby with $$$ in their eyes and after a relative short time, they realize that it's a hobby first, and they stay with the hobby, or they cut their losses and move on to something else.
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Rest in Peace
Canada
1360 Posts |
Quote:
My only thought, is the buyer market virtually the same for new gold Star Trek coins as the one that's already become Supermaned-out? And that my friend is why I only bought two. With any luck, I will sell one for a few hundred more than I paid (will pay) for it...but if it doesn't sell, I think my brother would flip to receive it as a Christmas gift in December. ps... is "Supermaned" a real word?  Edited by Dcadon
05/15/2016 5:06 pm
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
2845 Posts |
Quote:
ps... is "Supermaned" a real word?
I have no idea but if "Trekkie" is, then what the heck!  |
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
3690 Posts |
My opinion? Not the same fan base. I've never seen a kid wearing Star Trek pajamas or dressed as Captain Kirk for Halloween. Never heard of a Superman convention (though there probably are some) but there are several Star Trek exclusives this year alone. And let's not forget the effects of current pop culture icons like the characters on The Big Bang Theory. They like Superman, they love Star Trek.  Seriously, I really believe the demographic for ST is much older than SM and that they have deeper pockets. Of course this is based on exactly zero market research on my part. Just wait for the Minecraft coins. Those will be the next big hit for anyone under 20. |
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
3690 Posts |
Quote:
I have no idea but if "Trekkie" is, then what the heck!
Careful.... "The term "Trekker" is preferred by some Star Trek fans as the term "Trekkie" is considered to be a derogatory term. One joke is that Trekkers "know it's just a TV show" versus Trekkies, in reference to William Shatner's famous rant on Saturday Night Live." I posted that Shatner rant on page 1 of this thread for anyone who wants to relive it. lol Edited by CC-Ottawa
05/15/2016 4:24 pm
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
2845 Posts |
Quote:
Careful....
Oops, my mistake!  Trekker it is then! Indeed the "er" has a much more rugged, adventurist tone to it, as opposed to "ie". "To boldly go where" ever that might be..... |
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
2984 Posts |
The gold Star Trek coin will never go below issue price. The bottom line is the gold Star Trek coin will make money for those who decide to re-sell it. How much I don't know but I believe people are too optimistic in thinking it will go for 2x or 3x issue price. There has never been a RCM NCLT coin that had an issue price of more than $1000 reselling for 2x or 3x original cost. As for the people at the convention, are they willing to pay $2000-$3000 for a coin when they can get something similar to this that you can get for $30? Remember, not all Star Trek fans are coin collectors.  |
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Posted 05/15/2016 11:06 am
