New... Dan Carr 1964 Morgan Dollars!

Or this one.

http://www.govmint.com/us-coins/exc...-gem-pr.html

I don't see a difference between them. Both could potentially be used for evil, yes, but so can hammers, cars, spoons... etc. I can understand completely both viewpoints but I will enjoy this issue I believe and am looking forward to receiving it. :)

Lets get something perfectly clear here OK.
The DC offerings are NOT coins.
They may originally have been official US coinage but when they are overstruck the original design is totally destroyed and replaced with a new one.
Governments around the World have done this before to another nations coinage But that had been sanctioned by the government of the day and those are indeed official coins, Dan Cars overstrikes have not been officially sanctioned by the US government so they are NOT officially coins.

To compare these to a hobo nickle is quite frankly ludicrous, There is absolutely NO similarity whatsoever.
With a hobo nickle the design has been changed by carving into the coin and no two coins are identical.
With the DC offerings the original coins design has been completely destroyed and has been replaced with a design that is similar to genuine US coins but with a fictitious date and there are multitudes that are identical.

The Sad thing is that people can't see the dangers that these DC overstrikes pose to the collecting community or Worse they DON"T CARE as long as they are making a profit
These Dan Carr offerings may be beautifully made but it reality they are an abomination and NOT a real coin.
To add one of these to a collection wouldn't enhance it, It would actually debase a collections integrity.

This statement is supported by the fact these threads are located in the 'Tokens, Medals, and other Exonumia' forum.

Yeah jbuck. That's a mistake and I'm sad to see you guys doing that. Its a shame

So if I put a Morgan dollar in a 20 ton hydraulic press and with big cotter pin dies, the cotter pin is still a coin? Just altered right?

If I put a soda can in a 20 ton hydraulic press with coin dies in it, it's still a soda can right? Just altered right?

They are no longer legal tender so in that respect they are not a technical coin per say but they are still coins that have just been altered. That's the very crux of why what he does is kosher and why part of the HPA was ammened with Dan Carr overstrikes specifically in mind. Do what he's doing using blanks and there's a problem. It is a fine line but one Dan is on the correct side of.

Trout, I have no agenda other than being a big fan of his work and as such I support it whole heartedly. Conversely, what is the agenda of those that simply don't like them or what he does and go out of their way to slam them at every turn using baseless arguments? That's what I take issue with. The main argument that they violate the HPA is now moot, the argument of people getting burned by them has always been baseless as there is not one documented case and his work is easily identified with a simple Google search plus his work already sells for big premiums.

And about me destroying my theory, for example, he has sold over 700 of his 1964d morgans so far while only 13 have sold and only 5 are available for sale.

I think that you are even confusing yourself with that statement
Just admit it Mate the detractors of these with your so called "Baseless arguments" are right and you are wrong, End of story

I like Mr. Carr's work product and will buy his offerings regardless of what you want to call them; I consider them medallic art in the style of famous coin designs of years gone by. If the government suddenly develops a problem with that, they're welcome to come kick down my door and take them out of my cabinet. I may not have a million-dollar collection, but Mr. Carr's artwork is as deserving of its cabinet space as much as any Morgan dollar or large cent. I don't plan on ever selling them, and I certainly wouldn't spend them.

Art and sculpture are often recreated in the style of the original; these copies are not considered to be damaging or debasing their owners' collections...if I have a nearly flawless modern collectors' canvas of a Monet hanging in the hallway, for my enjoyment and appreciation, and am making no attempt to pass it off as an original work or sell it as such, why shouldn't I be allowed to enjoy it?

As to a "coin" -- that depends on intent, in my opinion -- a Carr overstrike is an alteration and I still consider it a coin, albeit altered, in the same way that a counterstamped coin is still a coin; because they were LEGAL TENDER at some point prior to being altered, they remain coins as such. Medals and tokens not passing as legal tender are not coins by this definition, although still related to numismatics, and to me, that is what makes for exonumia.

Mr. Carr is careful to pick and choose dates and mintmark combinations which never existed, hence the "fantasy" label; by doing so, there is absolutely zero chance of confusion with genuine coinage issues. As he is quite famous and well-known within numismatic circles and at the Mint and Treasury Department, any attempt on his part to actually create forgeries of real coins would be almost certainly immediately noticed and quickly prosecuted. On top of that, the man's shown no evil streak or ill will nor any tendency to play the counterfeiter role, so wild speculation that he might suddenly churn out near-perfect forgeries of key-date rarities is unfounded.