Coin Community Family of Web Sites Join Thousands of Coin, Bullion, & Money Collectors
Coin, Banknote and Medal Collectors's Online Mall Specializing in Modern Numismatics Shop for APMEX Bullion on eBay!Royal Canadian Mint products, Canadian, Polish, American, and world coins and banknotes. Vancouvers #1 Coin and Paper Money Dealer 300,000 items to help build your collection! Join Thousands of Coin, Bullion, & Money Collectors








Username:
Password:
Save Password
Forgot your Password?


This page may contain links that result in small commissions to keep this free site up and running.

Welcome Guest! Registering and/or logging in will remove the anchor (bottom) ads. It's Free!

Another Toner Lover Question--Peace Dollars?

To participate in the forum you must log in or register.
Author Previous TopicReplies: 15 / Views: 1,390Next Topic  
Pillar of the Community
twslisa's Avatar
United States
790 Posts
 Posted 11/28/2016  08:28 am Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add twslisa to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
I watched a few Great Collections auctions last night. Did a search on "toned" dollar coins. There were a couple Peace dollars, graded MS60-61, with rainbow toning. I'm sorry I didn't get pics, but one had a broad band of deep spectrum rainbow toning along the upper rim. The other had more of a pastel spectrum across the entire obverse. Both showed visible dings and rub on the higher elevations but there was also visible luster.

I have read articles in which people opine that any rainbow Peace dollar is a fake; that said, these appeared legit to me (I'm no expert, but the color spectrum looked right, I did see pull away, and the toning varied over the elevations, and generally had the imperfections you'd expect from legit toning).

Both went for a bit of a premium over the book price. So here's my question: how much of a premium would you pay for rainbow toning on coins other than Morgan's, such as Peace dollars?

*** Moved by Staff to a more appropriate forum. ***

Pillar of the Community
Debrajc's Avatar
United States
4211 Posts
 Posted 11/28/2016  1:10 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Debrajc to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
On Peace dollars no.
On Morgan dollars perhaps a bit but not much.
Pillar of the Community
Dustin6's Avatar
United States
3516 Posts
 Posted 11/28/2016  1:17 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Dustin6 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Toned Peace dollars are harder to find hence bringing more of a profit, morgans are easier to find toned
Rest in Peace
moxking's Avatar
United States
17900 Posts
 Posted 11/28/2016  1:46 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add moxking to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The vast majority of graded piece dollars, even if you get into the MS 64-67 range are either lustrous, or have a single monotone "gray" tone, or are splotchy and blotchy and ugly. Finding truly beautiful toning on a Peace dollar is very difficult, regardless of the date or mint mark.

I will say this, and it's a bit like saying something sacrilegious, but if the toning is in a PCGS holder I'd be more hesitant to believe it's real toning. NGC is much better about weeding out "helped" toning.

I use a pretty simple rule for determining toning, myself - if it's gradual color change, especially if it radiates from the periphery, then I am much more inclined to believe it.

If it is splotchy with color bounces here and there in no particular pattern and no progression to a pattern, I do not remain interested.
Pillar of the Community
twslisa's Avatar
United States
790 Posts
 Posted 11/28/2016  4:06 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add twslisa to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Agree, moxking. By the way, the Peace dollar I mentioned on the other thread has a small amount of gold toning around the crown. Part of why I think it's so beautiful. But most PD's I've seen, if toned, are really kind of grotty looking.

I am partial to PD's also. I guess I love the concept--they thought they'd fought the war to end all wars. PEACE!
Bedrock of the Community
BH1964's Avatar
United States
10982 Posts
Rest in Peace
moxking's Avatar
United States
17900 Posts
 Posted 11/28/2016  4:49 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add moxking to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Thanks for those,BH.

As far as eye appeal, first is nice, second I don't love, third I dislike.
Bedrock of the Community
Coinfrog's Avatar
United States
94367 Posts
 Posted 11/28/2016  4:53 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Coinfrog to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Yes, I could live with the first one very easily.
Pillar of the Community
Slider23's Avatar
United States
4468 Posts
 Posted 11/28/2016  6:50 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Slider23 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
I have read articles in which people opine that any rainbow Peace dollar is a fake; that said, these appeared legit to me (I'm no expert, but the color spectrum looked right, I did see pull away, and the toning varied over the elevations, and generally had the imperfections you'd expect from legit toning).


I want to give you a heads up to stay away from the seller in the link below or coins that have similar toning. The seller is known for using gas to tone coins in holders.

282233028238
Rest in Peace
moxking's Avatar
United States
17900 Posts
 Posted 11/28/2016  7:32 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add moxking to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
That guy is all kinds of bad news.
Bedrock of the Community
sel_69l's Avatar
Australia
21786 Posts
 Posted 11/28/2016  8:33 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add sel_69l to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
In some cases, the seller has worked very hard to artificailly tone the coins he has to sell. He probably feels fully justified to be rewarded for his skill, and charges what he feels to be an approrpiate price.
(Or suckers ebay bidders into paying his price).
Pillar of the Community
twslisa's Avatar
United States
790 Posts
 Posted 11/28/2016  9:17 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add twslisa to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Agree with opinions on all three. The second might look better in hand, but the pic makes it look really odd, even tho I actually do like the colors. and yes, the first two were the coins I described. If I saw the third I passed right by.

I think I would only buy a rainbow Peace dollar that was graded and slabbed. I know that doesn't rule out AT, but it would help my confidence.
Pillar of the Community
Cascade's Avatar
United States
7390 Posts
 Posted 11/28/2016  9:25 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Cascade to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Peace dollars and 1921 morgans with exceptional color in PCGS, NGC or anacs slabs go for big bucks. They rarely tone like early morgans so when they do moon money is not unexpected
Pillar of the Community
Cascade's Avatar
United States
7390 Posts
 Posted 11/28/2016  9:27 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Cascade to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
For instance my avatar is a 1921s Morgan in PCGS 63. I had an offer of $1500 that I turned down
Pillar of the Community
bandsdean's Avatar
United States
2125 Posts
 Posted 11/28/2016  10:14 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add bandsdean to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I like the MS-61 the best...
Bedrock of the Community
paralyse's Avatar
United States
12057 Posts
 Posted 11/28/2016  11:12 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add paralyse to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The 1921+ Peace and 1921 Morgan dollars were not stored in the conditions which allowed many earlier Morgan dollars to acquire some of their beautiful toning. Most of them tended to tone black and brown, and especially after 1921, the Peace dollars often had lots of white milky areas to further lower the eye appeal. Occasionally, some would tone a golden hue, which was slightly better. Numismatic legend also has it that the 1922 LR and later planchets were washed with an unusually strong acidic rinse before being struck into coins, which changed the chemical composition of the surface and made it less amenable to forming the spectacular rainbow and pastel hues seen on 1904 and earlier Morgan dollars.

A very, very few were stored under the right conditions and environments, mostly the first year of issue, and those, when authentic, and actually on the market, tend to bring home-run bucks, as Cascade noted...I have seen attractively toned later date Peace dollars, but compared to Morgan dollars, the scarcity is much higher. The same thing goes for 1921-dated Morgan dollars, where specimens with attractive original toning tend to sell for way more than the grade would suggest, and don't often come on the market.
Member ANA - EAC - TNA - SSDC - CCT #890

"Most of the things worth doing in the world had been declared impossible before they were done." -- Louis D. Brandeis
  Previous TopicReplies: 15 / Views: 1,390Next Topic  

To participate in the forum you must log in or register.



    




Disclaimer: While a tremendous amount of effort goes into ensuring the accuracy of the information contained in this site, Coin Community assumes no liability for errors. Copyright 2005 - 2026 Coin Community Family- all rights reserved worldwide. Use of any images or content on this website without prior written permission of Coin Community or the original lender is strictly prohibited.
Contact Us  |  Advertise Here  |  Privacy Policy / Terms of Use

Coin Community Forum © 2005 - 2026 Coin Community Forums
It took 0.42 seconds to rattle this change. Forums