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Victoria Nobis Est & Grading Overstruck Coins

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Pillar of the Community
Wade's Avatar
Canada
2781 Posts
 Posted 01/08/2017  10:44 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add Wade to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
These tokens are found in both "regular" and overstruck varieties,

Grading the regular strikes is fairly straight forward, but with a re-purposed coin my question is, how does the host coin (in this case guppy half pennies) affect the re-strike?
will a worn host result in a more poorly, or better struck restrike?

If more of the host coin is showing would it grade higher? or lower? or does grading solely depend on the level of wear / quality of strike?

Below is my most recent addition, grade opinions welcomed. (sample host coin also shown).

Victoria-Nobis-Est-&-Grading-Overstruck-Coins

Victoria-Nobis-Est-&-Grading-Overstruck-Coins
Pillar of the Community
Canada
1222 Posts
 Posted 01/09/2017  09:03 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Hounddog Bill to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I really like these and the more of the host coin showing the better.
My understanding is normally collectors are looking for examples without the host coin showing and will pay a premium for them.
Here's a link where I asked basically the same questions as you.

http://goccf.com/t/230662

Cheers, Bill
Pillar of the Community
Wade's Avatar
Canada
2781 Posts
 Posted 01/09/2017  11:14 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Wade to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
thanks Bill,
love your coin - I have to agree, the more host the better. Based on yours I would guess mine at XF but still unsure if the host getting in the way would keep it from going higher. Will wait & see if Doug chimes in.

Pillar of the Community
United States
840 Posts
 Posted 01/09/2017  2:39 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add colonialtokens to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

This inquiry opens a bucket of worms which I have previously addressed on similar threads.
At present, I am unaware of any uniform consensus.

I am of the opinion that the grade of the host coin should not be taken into grading consideration.
The grade of the coin should only reflect the grade of the latest strike. An MS technical grade
(or any grade)should remain the same whether or not the host was struck from an old worn coin or a fresh
planchet. An MS technical grade (or any grade) of the final strike should not be lowered simply because
the host coin is a Fine or lowered even more if the host coin is a Poor. I am aware that some will disagree
with this opinion.
The restrike should be noted on the insert.

doug
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Wade's Avatar
Canada
2781 Posts
 Posted 01/09/2017  4:55 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Wade to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
thanks Doug,

so if we eliminate the host coin's grade (which I agree shouldn't matter) how does how much is left showing affect the grade.

if a good deal of original detail is left showing from the host does it drop the grade of the re-strike?

how would you assess my example where just a small portion of the host shows through?
Pillar of the Community
United States
840 Posts
 Posted 01/09/2017  11:13 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add colonialtokens to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Right or wrong, I would ignore whatever the condition of the host coin is.
I would grade the recent strike only and note being overstruck.

Many tokens are poorly coined. On certain series, many VF's are actually in MS.
The lack of detail is not necessarily attributed to wear, but may be the result of
a poorly manufactured die. (i.e., the Tiffin half pennies). Many tokens can not
be graded according to normal decimal coinage standards.

doug
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