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 Replies: 24 / Views: 3,222 |
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Valued Member
United States
87 Posts |
OK, I can't seem to find the exact answer to this. What exactly is the 'life cycle' of an uncirculated coin. While looking at the numismedia price guide, looking up grading on the forum, I got confused.
(Please Read the Following example Before answering the Question.... Thank You)
For example: If I go and get a roll of nickels at the bank, come home and open them and the whole roll is 2017 P nickels all with perfect luster but not cameo, are these nickels About uncirculated (graded AU50 to AU59) or are they uncirculated (graded MS60-MS70)? Obviously, they were struck for everyday circulation but they obviously haven't been circulated.
And are these considered "business strikes"? And so I assume they are made differently than proofs. So are uncirculated coins business strikes?
I'm sure this is a noob question but just got so confused reading the forum and numismedia.
Thanks for any help...
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Moderator
 United States
54280 Posts |
About (Almost) Uncirculated coins have been circulated and show just a very small amount of wear.
Business strikes are coins that are minted with the intent to be put into circulation.
Business strike nickels straight from the mint would be uncirculated.
2017 nickels from a whole roll obtained from a bank early in 2017 (the year of minting) are most likely uncirculated.
When business strikes are first distributed by the mint, they are uncirculated. Only after they have been released to stores and other places where they are given out as change, then spent multiple times to they actually start to exhibit enough wear to be graded "about" uncirculated.
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Moderator
United States
54280 Posts |
The first time a coin is released to the public and used in commerce it is technically "circulated".
However, the coin grade of uncirculated does not always means the coin was never spent and passed from person to store to person, etc.
When the wear starts to become apparent, then the coin loses its uncirculated grade and become about uncirculated.
MS = mint state = uncirculated
AU = circulated = shows signs of wear
Edited by nss-52
03/21/2017 6:53 pm
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Pillar of the Community
United States
869 Posts |
 Well stated. |
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Rest in Peace
10197 Posts |
Another point OP mentioned is the cameo. This refers to a proof coin, minted specifically that way, takes a polished planchet and is double struck. These are not issued as "business strikes...business strike, hence for circulation are the scale P-01 through MS-70, altho it is difficult to get a graded MS7o unless purchased from the mint. Proof coins are graded on the same scale albeit is PF-01 through PF-70, the "perfect" coin, with most quality proofs being PF-62 and above. Make any sense?
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Rest in Peace
United States
7075 Posts |
Just my opinion but I think that the whole grading scale is all about looks and has nothing to do with the actual history of the coin.
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Moderator
United States
56855 Posts |
Note: Not all proofs have cameos. Sometimes proofs are struck more than twice. A 2017 roll of coins from a bank would be MS,mint state. Should grade MS 64 or higher. MS 70 would be a long shot to find in a roll. MS is business struck coins. John 1  |
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Rest in Peace
United States
17900 Posts |
I tend to agree with Buddy in this instance. Unless the coins are received directly from the mint their history, which is uncertain, does not affect or influence the grade. The coins grade (condition), strike, and eye appeal will determine the market value.
If you beat an uncirculated coin it's grade will be reduced to MS-60. Dings, rim hits, scratches, railroad tracks, and other contact marks technically determine the Mint State between 60 and 70 and the points between.
A business strike cannot become a proof no matter how perfect it is, and a Proof cannot become a business strike, no matter what hardships it might encounter.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
865 Posts |
I gotta disagree that MS means uncirculated. MS stands for Mint State, meaning the state of the coin as it left the mint. If a coin is considered circulated as soon as it's released to the public then technically there are no uncirculated coins, right? MS does not mean uncirculated. And I agree with buddy, the history of the coin does not affect the grade, it's graded the way the coin presents.
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Moderator
United States
54280 Posts |
Quote:
I gotta disagree that MS means uncirculated. MS stands for Mint State, meaning the state of the coin as it left the mint. If a coin is considered circulated as soon as it's released to the public then technically there are no uncirculated coins, right? MS does not mean uncirculated. Uncirculated is a coin grade. It does not mean the coin has never actually been in circulation. Uncirculated (as a coin grade) actually means it doesn't look like it has ever been in circulation. To get accurately labeled as "uncirculated" no proof is necessary that you didn't, for example, just take it out of your pocket. MS is a coin grade. MS grades are applied to uncirculated (looking) coins. (see comments above) Many, many MS and "uncirculated" coins didn't come straight from the mint, but were actually plucked out of "circulation". To get a third party to grade your coin as MS, you need not sign an affidavit or submit proof that the coin has never been spent or been in anyone's pocket. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1119 Posts |
Quote:
with most quality proofs being PF-62 and above for some classic proofs maybe; a grade of PF62 for a modern proof coin would be extremely low. most modern proofs should easily receive a grade of PF69 unless you take the coin out of its OGP and handle it. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1119 Posts |
the biggest thing to understand is that proof is not a grade of coin its a type of strike
business strikes are the regular everyday coins you most commonly get as change
proofs are a specially struck coin with more care taken in every step of the minting process. modern proofs often have mirror like fields and frosted devices. classic (older) proofs may or may not display frosted devices, known as cameo but will often display a better strike with commonly higher relief.
further there are some coins in special sets that are neither business strikes nor proofs. these are often referred to as specimen coins and will be graded SP01- SP70
Edited by Steele
03/22/2017 9:53 pm
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Valued Member
 United States
87 Posts |
So once I found a proof Alabama State Quarter from a soda machine. It was an S and had a special luster not found on ordinary State Quarters. However, it had definitely been circulated. So for what I understand, this coin would be graded between Pr1-Pr70. Right? But would most likely be less than Pr60? Edited by mnknight77
03/24/2017 12:25 am
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Valued Member
United States
87 Posts |
Makes sense Crazyb0. So to find MS70's, you have to order business strikes from the mint or buy rolls from the bank... right?
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Pillar of the Community
United States
2403 Posts |
Quote:So once I found a proof Alabama State Quarter from a soda machine. It was an S and had a special luster not found on ordinary State Quarters. However, it had definitely been circulated. So for what I understand, this coin would be graded between Pr1-Pr70. Right? But would most likely be less than Pr60? You are correct. However if it grades below PR60 it is called an "impaired" proof. Edited by MontCollector
03/24/2017 12:35 am
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Valued Member
United States
87 Posts |
Moxking and Buddy,
If the history of the coin isn't taken into account, then why do AU-58 look better than MS60?
And if the history is unknown, then do you automatically push it down to the AU if it has at least some wear? And then bump it up to the MS if there isn't any obvious wear?
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Replies: 24 / Views: 3,222 |
Posted 03/21/2017 6:50 pm
