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1970 D Error Before The Strike?

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tropicalbats's Avatar
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 Posted 04/05/2017  12:48 pm Show Profile   Check tropicalbats's eBay Listings Bookmark this topic Add tropicalbats to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
I am unsure of what exactly this is. Looks like some sort of planchet error before the strike because the grooves do not go through the letters. Nothing but a slightly stronger beveling on the edge at that area (middle coin). Thanks for any help here!



1970-D-Error-Before-The-Strike?

1970-D-Error-Before-The-Strike?

1970-D-Error-Before-The-Strike?

1970-D-Error-Before-The-Strike?
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coop's Avatar
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 Posted 04/05/2017  1:58 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add coop to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The reverse looks like a Struck Through Grease issue. Note how the devices are enlarged because the tops of the devices (the narrow part of the devices) are prevented from forming on those areas. Even the building is affected. But on the obverse it looks like the start on attrition on the motto. Loos like the alignment of the die was incorrect and damaged the field in that area. (hit the edge of the collar) but it looks like it was corrected as it didn't continue to be worn down. But the two events may have happened at the same time. I'm going to send Mike Diamond a note on this one. It does look interesting.
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 Posted 04/05/2017  2:21 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add mikediamond to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I would agree that the two errors are unrelated. The obverse definitely has some sort of peripheral die damage, but I hesitate to characterize it as either collar clash or a die attrition error. I suppose it could be damage from colliding with the top of the collar (a form of collar clash), but the thin, arcing ridges are not entirely consistent with that scenario.

It looks like the poorly-struck areas could be either a grease strike or a slightly weak strike. In either case, it looks like the poor strike has revealed a slightly cracked surface. If so, we're looking at a planchet error. These superficial cracks might have been smoothed-out by the strike in other areas.
Error coin writer and researcher.
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coop's Avatar
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 Posted 04/05/2017  4:22 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add coop to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Mike did you need to see it in hand? It is the first time I've seen this before. (probably not the case for you) Just realized the area on both sides are not on the same area of the coin. The obverse area would show on the bottom of the reverse area and I see nothing there.
Edited by coop
04/05/2017 4:24 pm
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 Posted 04/05/2017  5:06 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add mikediamond to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I don't understand your observations and analysis. The weakness on the reverse lies opposite the bust of Lincoln in vertical space. That's what you'd expect of a slightly weak strike or a grease strike that produces a "greasy ghost" image. The high points of Lincoln's coat are also poorly struck, which cause me to lean more toward the weak strike diagnosis.
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 Posted 04/05/2017  9:35 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add cwb to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
OP Said "groves". That tells me they are incuse lines on the obverse side. This wouldn't be due to a mark on the die as that would show on the coin's surface as a raised mark.

The marks do look raised though.
Edited by cwb
04/05/2017 9:38 pm
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 Posted 04/06/2017  08:38 am  Show Profile   Check tropicalbats's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add tropicalbats to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I actually thought this would be an easy call for an expert as only so many things could do this. But seems like it isn't so straightforward!

I debated about using the word "grooves" because what are the marks, the grooves or the ridges? I don't know, but since the grooves are down into the field on the left side I went with that.

Here are some comparative photos to show what is raised and what is grooved. The yellow lines are incised and between them is raised. On the right above the you is a set of four very small stair steps, but they are very small are darn hard to tell exactly which way what goes in the lighting. But they start at the field and end at the top of the rim.



1970-D-Error-Before-The-Strike?

1970-D-Error-Before-The-Strike?

1970-D-Error-Before-The-Strike?

1970-D-Error-Before-The-Strike?
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 Posted 04/08/2017  08:04 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add mikediamond to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The new photos leave me more comfortable with a collar clash diagnosis. Multiple impacts with the top of the collar could produce a series of steps or grooves in the edge of the field portion of the die.
Error coin writer and researcher.
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 Posted 04/09/2017  11:36 pm  Show Profile   Check tropicalbats's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add tropicalbats to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Thank you Mike. I have been doing what research I can on this and now with your comment I think I can label this one as collar clash and be pretty confident with that. IT is a new error type for my collection.
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 Posted 04/13/2017  4:11 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add coop to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Edited images for my educational files.
1970-D-Error-Before-The-Strike?
1970-D-Error-Before-The-Strike?
1970-D-Error-Before-The-Strike?
Edited by coop
04/13/2017 4:27 pm
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