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1919 S Lincoln Wheat Cent Die Wear Or Something Else Mint Mark

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 Posted 01/19/2018  9:33 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add Wendell to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers

1919-S-Lincoln-Wheat-Cent-Die-Wear-Or-Something-Else-Mint-Mark
1919-S-Lincoln-Wheat-Cent-Die-Wear-Or-Something-Else-Mint-Mark
1919-S-Lincoln-Wheat-Cent-Die-Wear-Or-Something-Else-Mint-Mark
1919-S-Lincoln-Wheat-Cent-Die-Wear-Or-Something-Else-Mint-Mark
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cwb's Avatar
United States
3463 Posts
 Posted 01/19/2018  9:41 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add cwb to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
It's not die wear.
Looks interesting, can you try to get a clearer picture of it?
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 Posted 01/19/2018  9:48 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Wendell to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I'll try
Valued Member
United States
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 Posted 01/19/2018  10:03 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Wendell to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I've tried that the best pic I can take
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Crazyb0's Avatar
10197 Posts
 Posted 01/19/2018  10:08 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Crazyb0 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Not the only known one tho...


1919-S-Lincoln-Wheat-Cent-Die-Wear-Or-Something-Else-Mint-Mark
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cwb's Avatar
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 Posted 01/19/2018  10:33 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add cwb to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
J Wexler lists two S RPMs for that year, but it's neither one of them: http://doubleddie.com/902255.html
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fortcollins's Avatar
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 Posted 01/19/2018  11:18 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add fortcollins to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Wendell, I played around with your photo a bit and enhanced the mint mark. This is the best I could do with clarity and some background enhancement to eliminate the clutter.

1919-S-Lincoln-Wheat-Cent-Die-Wear-Or-Something-Else-Mint-Mark

It's definitely interesting. I don't know the early San Francisco Lincoln varieties all that well. Having pawed through several thousand early Denver Lincolns, I know there are quite a few RPMs and a couple minor DDOs that aren't in the literature yet. I have to believe that there are plenty of new San Francisco varieties to find as well, and it sure looks like you landed on one of them. Nice find!
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cwb's Avatar
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 Posted 01/19/2018  11:23 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add cwb to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
With all of the scuff marks it's difficult to tell if it is an RPM or just damage. I suggest talking to John Wexler about it, maybe he would be interested in seeing the coin in hand.
His email address is listed at the bottom of this web page: http://doubleddie.com/1801.html
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spru's Avatar
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 Posted 01/19/2018  11:59 pm  Show Profile   Check spru's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add spru to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Personally, my vote is for damage. It looks like the upper loop of the S took a hit and metal was pushed both north and south.

Neither of the now doubled upper loops is in the correct position for an S mintmark.

The only other thing I can think of is a broken punch, but how that middle raised part was created by that, I dont know.
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 Posted 01/20/2018  03:25 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Mrzllewellyn to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
My vote is a hit from the south west chopping the upper loop of the MM pushing it up and raising metal under it and the downward raise from that one as the top of the S is on top of that raised metal
Edited by Mrzllewellyn
01/20/2018 03:25 am
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Coinfrog's Avatar
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 Posted 01/20/2018  09:58 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Coinfrog to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Basically -
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coop's Avatar
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 Posted 01/20/2018  1:19 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add coop to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I agree it looks like damage to me. If it were a RPM, would have been more listed/found of a die this obvious.
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 Posted 01/20/2018  2:19 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Wendell to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Thanks every body for your help
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fortcollins's Avatar
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3663 Posts
 Posted 01/20/2018  3:54 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add fortcollins to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I'm still leaning toward RPM here.

1. When I enlarge the mm photo, I don't see any obvious damage to the areas of the primary mm that would give me comfort explaining the metal to the North. The only serious damage is to the outside curve of the lower loop, and that metal wouldn't have ended up north of the upper loop. in fact, the damage to the lower loop looks to have deposited its metal adjacent to and at the top outside of the lower loop.

2. What I do see that intrigues me is what appears to be a light curved line descending NW to SE through the middle of the top loop of the primary S. I can't explain that one with damage, and it is about where the descending curve of a north secondary S would be found.

3. I also see a horizontal line through the bottom loop of the primary S that could (and I emphasize "could") be the return of the bottom loop of a secondary S. That's close to the damaged area, and much better photos would be needed to be sure.

There are still some unlisted RPMs in the early Lincolns. My 1916-D with the D/probable D East/definite tilted D Southeast is readily apparent, but hasn't been listed either. I can't explain how that one has hung around unnoticed for a century.

I pawed through my 1919-S junk box last night, and couldn't find anything close to your coin. That doesn't add much to the discussion, because my junk box was pulled from circulation in the 1960's, only has a hundred or so coins in that box, and most of those are shrapnel. My two higher grade 1919-S cents are boring, with clear, plain mint marks.

Back to your coin, Wendell, I think sharper photos are essential. This is one that I would send in for attribution. There is enough possibility here that it would be worth it.
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