| Author |
 Replies: 22 / Views: 6,006 |
|
Valued Member
269 Posts |
In 1965 submissions for a future $1 coin were put forth and one result was the 1967 patter Goose dollar made by John Pinches medalists in London. There were silver and gold versions made and all are valuable. China latched onto this quickly and their fakes are now selling on ebay for good amounts. Here is a current fake on ebay with bidding currently at over $700 - slabbed by PCCB of course. 263459886726All genuine Swan pattern dollars have it's designer's initials [Andor Meszaros] at the 4 o'clock position on the obverse - which is the side with the duck. Please be wary of these. |
|
|
|
Valued Member
 269 Posts |
I spent a moment looking at this again and I need to qualify a few points. This coin has no legal status whatsoever (The commonwealth holds copyright only on official coins minted after 1 May 1969) - it's maker was bought out by the Franklin mint, it's designer is long dead, and ACR magazine hasn't existed for 17 years. There is nothing wrong with buying a copy of this for whatever reason - it's a nice coin whether it's genuine or not. The original is nothing more than a metal souvenir of a non copyrighted design. This image is the specimen at Museum Victoria and it shows uneven rims, a poor strike and a mess of the Andor Meszáros initials which appear differently on every genuine example. The only 'wrong' here is the deceptive act of misrepresenting a modern copy as one of the originals made in London in 1967. In the strictest terms, it's not a coin or a token and there is no legal recourse whatsoever for those that buy copies. Long live the duck coin.  |
|
Pillar of the Community
United States
3468 Posts |
I'm not surprised a person who doesn't know the difference between a duck and a goose wouldn't appreciate the difference between authentic items and counterfeits.
|
|
Valued Member
Australia
369 Posts |
Quote:
In the strictest terms, it's not a coin or a token and there is no legal recourse whatsoever for those that buy copies. . It's out and out Fraud if it's a fake. Doesn't have to be a coin or token to be a fake. There are plenty of fake handbags out there. Fraud is an offence as far as I know. The legal recourse is there but probably more expensive to prove. |
|
Pillar of the Community
United States
3184 Posts |
I never heard of this coin but took a look...........beautiful, love the reverse design of the goose.
|
|
Pillar of the Community
Australia
3831 Posts |
Fake handbags are a different story. There are lawyers in handbags companies that actively handle lawsuits specifically for this. LVMH spent a fortune against ebay with regards to counterfeit and it was a bitter case. http://fortune.com/2014/07/17/louis...-knock-offs/The problem is this - with modern coinage, perhaps official mints may be able to chase sellers over modern counterfeits, i.e. 1900s onwards. But what can you do about ancient coins or older coinage? |
|
Valued Member
269 Posts |
Quote:
I'm not surprised a person who doesn't know the difference between a duck and a goose wouldn't appreciate the difference between authentic items and counterfeits. Thank you for your ever so insightful and kind words. It is neither a duck or goose as it so happens - it's a swan. Duck is the common name for a large number of species in the waterfowl family Anatidae, which also includes swans and geese. I use the term in humour - obviously. You're welcome.  |
|
Pillar of the Community
Australia
652 Posts |
And a Black Swan at that.
|
|
Bedrock of the Community
United States
94367 Posts |
Why is that a swan? The length of the neck?  |
|
Pillar of the Community
Australia
1364 Posts |
I was also wondering why it is called the 'goose' dollar until I came across this: 'The Swan Pattern dollar has been nicknamed the "Goose dollar" by collectors and has risen in popularity in the past few years'... from here https://www.australian-coins.com/au...or-meszaros/ |
|
Pillar of the Community
United States
7840 Posts |
I really like the design of the 1967 Dollar of Australia, I would like an authentic one though.
|
|
Valued Member
269 Posts |
The plot thickens ... Until now the only easy way to discern an English duck struck in London from a Chinese duck was to look for Andor Meszaros's initials at 4 o'clock on the obverse (duck side). Today this appeared on ebay Australia. 263478638735(go to ebay and paste that into the search field if autoredirect doesn't work) et voila! We have the marking at 4 o'clock. So.. we're looking at a genuine example right? Wrong. Another 263473885735Both will sell and both buyers will be happy, maybe that's all that matters. Edited by CoinOS
02/05/2018 8:37 pm
|
|
Valued Member
269 Posts |
This 263473885735 just sold on ebay for AUD $1,749.00  - and within minutes another identical one appeared from the same seller: 263481015376 Each of the genuine (1967 original) Swan patterns came in a maroon presentation case which was well made. I advise buyers to either only shop for PCGS or NGC certified examples or those that have the original case and note. I hope these posts will save someone a few hard earned dollars. If anyone really wants a copy of that coin - China sells them for virtually nothing in Silver plated and $150 for 90% Silver. Edited by CoinOS
02/06/2018 1:12 pm
|
|
Pillar of the Community
United States
3184 Posts |
CoinOS, have you contacted ebay and informed ebay about this? This is so wrong what they are doing. I like the design and would love a NGC or PCGS example. |
|
Valued Member
269 Posts |
Quote: have you contacted ebay and informed ebay about this? Hi. ebay Australia's policy is caveat emptor and there is so far as I can see, no option to report forgeries or counterfeits. To your question, yes I did. They deleted some posts I made and warned me that using that sale number [which identifies the seller] constitutes 'naming and shaming' which is a no-no. A direct Emailed letter to ebay is so far unanswered. The thing is that up til recently, the 4 o'clock obverse signature was used to separate original from copy - that can no longer be the test, it's now meaningless. I could make an effort to track down who is making the new ones, be it China or elsewhere, but it's a road to nowhere. I only hope that exposure on this and other forums might make prospective buyers think twice and look more closely. To illustrate my point as to how far China has come with fake Australian stuff - here is a fake 1967 pattern Swan made of 92.5 silver and it weighs 28.7 grams - both matching original specs.[Selling now at Chinese website for US$120/AUD160] The signature aside - these will need a very skilled eye to spot as fake because the reproduction quality is spectacular. This particular one has clear clues on the surface - but many are near perfect.  Cheers Edited by CoinOS
02/07/2018 09:49 am
|
|
Pillar of the Community
Australia
908 Posts |
Quote:CoinOS, have you contacted ebay and informed ebay about this? This is so wrong what they are doing. ebay doesn't give a *** Edited by Staff | The bad word filter is in place for a reason. Bypassing the filter and making the intended word obvious anyway is completely unacceptable. *** about counterfeit coins selling on their site.You can report them till you're blue in the face and the fact is that if they removed fakes they would make a lot less money |
| |
Replies: 22 / Views: 6,006 |
Posted 01/29/2018 10:27 am
