Ebay Fined $66m For Selling Counterfeit/Fake ... Goods

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Peter THOMAS Pillar of the Community Australia 2830 Posts	Posted 07/01/2008 12:44 am Quote: A Paris court has ordered the online auctioneer ebay to pay 40 million euro ($A65.8 million) in damages to Louis Vuitton for selling fake luxury goods online. The commercial court ruled in favour of six LVMH brands which accused ebay of putting on sale fake handbags, clothes and other luxury goods and of illicit sales of perfumes in a case that began a year and a half ago. ebay, the world's biggest online auctioneer, was ordered to pay 19.28 million euro to LVMH and 17.3 million euro to its sister company Christian Dior Couture for damage to their brand images and causing moral harm. It must also pay 3.25 million euro to four perfume brands - Christian Dior, Kenzo, Givenchy and Guerlain - for sales in violation of its authorised network. The court barred ebay, which said it will appeal against the ruling, from advertising the cosmetic or perfume brands on its website. LVMH had argued that ebay had failed to do enough to prevent the sale of counterfeit copies of their goods and that it did not have legal permission to sell its authentic products. The ruling came amid a flurry of legal action against the online giant, which claims to have some 84 million active users in 39 markets worldwide. Earlier this month, ebay was convicted by a French court of selling counterfeit goods and ordered to pay 20,000 euro in damages to French luxury group Hermes. The court ruling, which marked a first in France, found ebay directly responsible for the sale on its website of three Hermes bags including two fakes, for a total of 3000 euro. France's traditional auctioneers took legal action against the online auctioneer in December, accusing it of encouraging trade in pirated and stolen goods. A council representing the auction industry also accuses the Internet trader of breaking a French 2000 law that requires all auctioneers to be approved by the state. According to ebay the total value of items sold on its trading platforms in 2007 was nearly $US60 billion ($A62.5 billion). Comment: the alarm bells must be ringing in whichever part of the E-bay Empire looks after "risk management". Peter in Oz <<<Edited by Tights24 to add full body and remove link>>> Report this Post to the Staff

GO Moderator United States 6563 Posts	Posted 07/01/2008 12:53 am Wow I'm surprised. Technically ebay didn't do anything wrong accept turn a blind eye.....that's if they even knew. ebay is no different then if someone from a flea market is selling cheap knock offs of brand name shoes. Would the seller get sued...or the owner of the building? This might be a first step for an international downfall of ebay. Every company from every country will try and find ways to take down the Bay. Once this hits the States......it's all downhill from here Report this Post to the Staff
Peter THOMAS Pillar of the Community Australia 2830 Posts	Posted 07/01/2008 01:48 am quote: "Technically ebay didn't do anything wrong accept turn a blind eye.....that's if they even knew." - if they didn't know, then it was their business- literally - to find out. In litigation, there is a principle known as the "Deep Pocket Rule": when you've been wronged, you don't just "go" for the obvious malefactor or tortfeasor (techy language for "bad guy"), but you look behind him. Then, you sue whomever has the deepest pocket - so the trouble is worth the effort. There is a similar principle in criminal law. When I was a young prosecutor, the Chief Magistrate said it succinctly: "if there were no receivers, there'd be less thieves". ebay charges a fee for its services, so it profits from these sales. If the sales are illegal, for whatever reason, then ebay is profiting from the commission of offences &/or civil wrongs. Peter Report this Post to the Staff
Mr Finger Valued Member United States 405 Posts	Posted 07/01/2008 03:16 am This is sort of like when Napster was sued for allowing pirated music to change hands via their servers...napster stated that since the files werent stored by them or actualy on their servers,that they werent liable...but the RIAA still won their case against them!....Therefore ,Ebay will still be liable since their servers were used to sell illegal merchandise Report this Post to the Staff
bobby131313 Forum Dad United States 24171 Posts	Posted 07/01/2008 11:05 am Quote: Ebay charges a fee for its services, so it profits from these sales. If the sales are illegal, for whatever reason, then ebay is profiting from the commission of offences &/or civil wrongs. ebay leases the space. That's all. They don't sell the product. If the Acme sells tainted food and people get sick, can you sue the guy they lease the building from? If I own a 40 acre lot and lease tables for a flea market every Tuesday and you buy a fake Rolex, can you sue me? If the French don't reverse this decision, you'll simply see ebay pull out from France. Which FYI, will simulate their local economy tremendously and could be Frances' plan... who knows. Shop CCF Members on eBay. Report this Post to the Staff
tights24 Pillar of the Community United States 2254 Posts	Posted 07/01/2008 12:45 pm Quote: If I own a 40 acre lot and lease tables for a flea market every Tuesday and you buy a fake Rolex, can you sue me? I believe you probably could be sued. I'm not talking based on my watching Law and Order every night, and I didn't stay at a Holiday Inn last night either. But wouldn't selling fake "anything" on your property ultimately be your responsibility? I don't think you can condone what happens on your property per se. I'm certainly not a law expert, but my guess is this would be no different than you selling it yourself. If someone living in my house was selling drugs, you can bet your butt I would be in the ringer for it if the person selling was caught. Just my Two Cents. Report this Post to the Staff
bobby131313 Forum Dad United States 24171 Posts	Posted 07/01/2008 12:53 pm Quote: I believe you probably could be sued. I doubt it or there would be no flea markets. I don't think I've ever been to a flea market that didn't have someone selling illegal knockoffs of something. Seriously. How about the Acme scenario? It's no different. Does the owner of the building have to police the food to protect himself? Shop CCF Members on eBay. Report this Post to the Staff
Peter THOMAS Pillar of the Community Australia 2830 Posts	Posted 07/01/2008 1:03 pm G'day Bobby, see what I wrote about "Deep Pockets". If Acme pays rent, then the landlord is profiting from their misconduct. What sympathy does the landlord deserve ? Peter Report this Post to the Staff
tights24 Pillar of the Community United States 2254 Posts	Posted 07/01/2008 1:19 pm I'm not saying it doesn't happen, I'm saying I think you could be liable is all. Of course, just my opinion on the whole thing. Pretty much like Peter says, deep pockets game..... Report this Post to the Staff
bobby131313 Forum Dad United States 24171 Posts	Posted 07/01/2008 1:20 pm Quote: If Acme pays rent, then the landlord is profiting from their misconduct. What sympathy does the landlord deserve? I'm sorry, it's absolutely positively ridiculous to hold the building owner responsible for the quality of Acme's food (unless of course the roof is leaking on it or something like that) and you'll never convince me otherwise. Shop CCF Members on eBay. Report this Post to the Staff
snowman Pillar of the Community United States 1840 Posts	Posted 07/01/2008 2:57 pm Quote: How about the Acme scenario? It's no different. Does the owner of the building have to police the food to protect himself? Bad analogy. According to the legal doctrine of stict product liability, anyone involved in the distribution process may be held accountable for a defective product despite culpability. The the trial would then be sent to a jury. A jury can and will do anything. Remember OJ Simpson? As much as I'd like to see ebay have to reign in the amount of fakes being sold, I think this legal verdict was gift wrapped for those French Companies. I'm fairly certain that a similar trademark case was thrown out of a US court. Report this Post to the Staff
tights24 Pillar of the Community United States 2254 Posts	Posted 07/01/2008 3:03 pm I don't think your ACME comparison is quite right though. It's not a "quality" problem. ebay isn't getting sued because someone is selling used or torn louis vitton goods. They are selling fakes. It makes it hard to compare to a grocery store. But on the other hand, I guess I could use your analogy for a place like Kohls selling counterfeit clothing. Would the landlord be responsible at that point? Somehow I think the landlord probably would have some type of contract stating liability or the lack thereof. Hmmm, it would be interesting to see what the ebay laws are. It has to be somewhere.. Bobby, you have to know where it is right? Report this Post to the Staff
bobby131313 Forum Dad United States 24171 Posts	Posted 07/01/2008 3:09 pm Quote: I don't think your ACME comparison is quite right though. It's not a "quality" problem. So the Supermarket owner takes milk from his own dairy down the road and packages it as TopBrand milk instead of his own and sells it at TopBrand's price. The owner of the building is liable? C'mon he's a businessman leasing a building, it doesn't require him to be a detective to cover his butt. I'm sorry, I think it's silly. Shop CCF Members on eBay. Report this Post to the Staff
SeatedNut Pillar of the Community United States 2797 Posts	Posted 07/01/2008 3:16 pm And Bobby wrote ... Quote: and you'll never convince me otherwise You all know this to be true, yet you persist! Report this Post to the Staff
biokemist6 Bedrock of the Community United States 12437 Posts	Posted 07/01/2008 3:26 pm Quote: As much as I'd like to see ebay have to reign in the amount of fakes being sold, I think this legal verdict was gift wrapped for those French Companies. I'm fairly certain that a similar trademark case was thrown out of a US court. That is exactly how I see it as well, the French auction houses did not want an internet competitor on their soil. Of course, the EU as a whole is making a real racket out of the protectionism business these days(see parmesan cheese, champagne, etc) Report this Post to the Staff
tights24 Pillar of the Community United States 2254 Posts	Posted 07/01/2008 3:27 pm Everyone argues with their parents once in a while..... Or at least make them see the light. Report this Post to the Staff
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Ebay Fined $66m For Selling Fake ... Goods