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Is This True Doubling On This 1973-S LMC

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Author Previous TopicReplies: 14 / Views: 1,137Next Topic  
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CouchDiver1978's Avatar
United States
386 Posts
 Posted 11/17/2018  11:22 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add CouchDiver1978 to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
It looks real enough to me...
Is-This-True-Doubling-On-This-1973-S-LMC
Is-This-True-Doubling-On-This-1973-S-LMC

The letters in GOD are almost as strong under a loop, but harder to photograph...
Edited by CouchDiver1978
11/18/2018 9:36 pm
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SilverDollar2017's Avatar
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8715 Posts
 Posted 11/18/2018  11:39 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add SilverDollar2017 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Looks like Machine Doubling to me.
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CouchDiver1978's Avatar
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386 Posts
 Posted 11/18/2018  2:21 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add CouchDiver1978 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Hopefully have some better images soon as I'm away from my better optics at the moment, but your orobably correct. These are tough as heck to find. Thanks for your comment!
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coop's Avatar
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62064 Posts
 Posted 11/18/2018  2:29 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add coop to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Why Topic Titles are Important

The title of your topic is very important. Let's say you need help attributing an 1896 Morgan dollar....

You should include the date, mintmark, and the denomination in your titles.

· Horrendous: Help!

· Bad: Need help with coin

· Better: Need help with Morgan Dollar

· Good: Need help with 1896 Morgan Dollar

· Awesome: Need help with VAM on 1896 Morgan Dollar

Also please add what you are seeing?
Give us a clues as to where you are looking on your coin?

This enables the members with expertise pertaining to your question to easily find and answer your question. The title of the topic also becomes the title of the topic's web page, which enables us to attract more collectors to the site. The more members we have, the more we learn.
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CouchDiver1978's Avatar
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386 Posts
 Posted 11/18/2018  9:34 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add CouchDiver1978 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Yikes!! My bad, it should read 1973-S. I'll go ahead and change it.

Too many hours at work and too many late nights staring through a hand lens...
Valued Member
CouchDiver1978's Avatar
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386 Posts
 Posted 11/18/2018  11:58 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add CouchDiver1978 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Here are a few higher rez pictures, but I'm still not able to capture everything the way I want. I may try again different light conditions if necessary.

In general I'm seeing a displacement of the devices in the motto from right to left, with the most dramatic shift in the letters "IN" and in the hair and forehead of Lincoln's bust (these seem to have maybe more of a nne to ssw shift).
Is-This-True-Doubling-On-This-1973-S-LMC
Is-This-True-Doubling-On-This-1973-S-LMC
Is-This-True-Doubling-On-This-1973-S-LMC
Is-This-True-Doubling-On-This-1973-S-LMC
Is-This-True-Doubling-On-This-1973-S-LMC

Is-This-True-Doubling-On-This-1973-S-LMC
Is-This-True-Doubling-On-This-1973-S-LMC
Edited by CouchDiver1978
11/19/2018 12:11 am
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CouchDiver1978's Avatar
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386 Posts
 Posted 11/19/2018  5:20 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add CouchDiver1978 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I think I finally got most of it this time.
Is-This-True-Doubling-On-This-1973-S-LMC

Is-This-True-Doubling-On-This-1973-S-LMC
Is-This-True-Doubling-On-This-1973-S-LMC
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Jim0815's Avatar
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5240 Posts
 Posted 11/19/2018  5:47 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Jim0815 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Honestly, I can see why you would think that it is a Doubled Die, but in all fairness it is the victim of a high bounce MD. It isn't shelflike as in most Machine Doubling. High bounce Machine Doubling happens when the die strikes the coin and when it rebounds shifts laterally and comes down again.
Edited by Jim0815
11/19/2018 5:48 pm
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CouchDiver1978's Avatar
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386 Posts
 Posted 11/19/2018  6:00 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add CouchDiver1978 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I would obviously hope that that is not the case. Every time I put light on it I see more and more detail so you could prove to be right who knows. I may need to let an expert actually inspect the coin in person. I'm still pretty new at all this so I'm out of my element when it comes to such things. I know this is got to be throwing some people for a loop because there's nothing readily available on the net that looks like it in the 73. Course I could definitely wrong on that too I don't know all the sources. Definitely appreciate the feedback.
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CouchDiver1978's Avatar
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386 Posts
 Posted 11/19/2018  6:15 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add CouchDiver1978 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Last picture I'm going to post unless there is a request another part of the coin. Also I thought MD was supposed to be all squared off shelf like and all the same color... If this is MD I'm completely lost and have no idea what to look for LOL

I'm unable to find much on Master die doubling for the 1973 but since there are spots where it looks like there's tripling I'm just wondering if this could be exhibiting some master dye doubling in addition to double die
Is-This-True-Doubling-On-This-1973-S-LMC
Edited by CouchDiver1978
11/19/2018 6:24 pm
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Jim0815's Avatar
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 Posted 11/19/2018  7:51 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Jim0815 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
If you have another 1973, compare it side by side. The biggest thing you will notice is there is a reduction in size of the "Top" part in which you're seeing. The reduction in the overall size of the devises is why it is a high bounce MD. I learned this from John1. But, when you consult your expert, please post to this thread to let us know what they have determined. Good luck! Go to errorref.com, when you get to that page and scroll down. There will be a search box. Type in high bounce Machine Doubling and you'll get the answer to what you're seeing.
Edited by Jim0815
11/19/2018 7:53 pm
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CouchDiver1978's Avatar
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386 Posts
 Posted 11/19/2018  10:24 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add CouchDiver1978 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I was thinking of using ESRI ArcMap software to basically georeference and superimpose the abnormal coin over a regular 72s to check that very thing. It's sort of hard (for me anyway) definite determination with a side-by-side, but that said, I think I can see what you're talking about. That's excellent advice many thanks for all the feedback.

I don't personally know any experts (no doubt many of you would fit that designation), and would be open to suggestions if you or any of the other guys has anybody they have used.

Of course no fatality would be complete without a coffin nail from John or from Coop LOL. I know there must be a million people like me a day questioning bad news and it's got to get old explaining the same thing over and over to us noobs, so just know that I do appreciate the feedback from everybody out there giving their honest opinions!
Edited by CouchDiver1978
11/19/2018 10:25 pm
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Jim0815's Avatar
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5240 Posts
 Posted 11/19/2018  10:38 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Jim0815 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
CouchDiver, I've only been collecting for a year. I take advice, listen to expertise from others and have learned a lot. That being said, I've still have a lot to learn. The reason I know what you have is because I had one very similar to yours, different date. I was told the same thing that I told you and from that point started to educate myself by reading other people's posts as well as looking at different sites. I'm no expert, but educating yourself will go a long way in this hobby. John1 was right when he told me what I had. Just like yours. Great site with some great people that'll be glad to help you as you learn. I'm glad I'm a member.
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CouchDiver1978's Avatar
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386 Posts
 Posted 11/19/2018  11:24 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add CouchDiver1978 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
No, I think I know you right and probably knew it all along. But you know how it is (better than I)... you look hard and you see something like that and you don't want to admit it to yourself after all that searching you came up short again.

Too many straight lines, too many shadows too much flatness .. there was quite a bit of depth in the O in God, but like you pointed out, the letter appears smaller as a result.

I have a expanding graveyard of dead soldiers, if you will. Each one of them entombed in its paper slab and replete with condensed annotations of what I thought they were, as well as conclusions from the members of this site.

At some point I was thinking of doing a post with just those... if nothing else might be educational for all noobs out there who would take up the hunt!

If there's a moral to this story, it probably go something like; be ready to work your tail of, prepared to deal with a lot of disappointment, and have the tenacity ( or pigheadedness in my case) to get back up and do it again.

Cheers!
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Jim0815's Avatar
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5240 Posts
 Posted 11/19/2018  11:34 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Jim0815 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Yes sir. Perseverance is the key to this hobby.
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