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More 1859 Obverse Bridge Dies

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Phil310's Avatar
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1101 Posts
 Posted 10/25/2019  09:37 am Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add Phil310 to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
There is a new announcement in the Haxby catalog regarding obverse "bridge dies" which were paired with both 1859/8 and narrow 9 reverse dies.

For some time it was thought there were only 3 bridge dies, but after a careful study of obverse dies we have found there are 2 more not previously listed.

You can get to the information on the latest news page announcement in the catalog. Here is a link to the news page.

https://www.vickycents.com/news--102519.html
Edited by Phil310
10/26/2019 06:21 am
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 Posted 10/26/2019  08:49 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add bosox to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Good job. As Jim and you keep changing the Narrow 9 die count and, as I continue my work with 1858, 1859 W9/8, and specimen cents, I try to keep track of what might be out there.

If I assume your 99 obverse die count included the five narrow 9 crossover dies, I count 39 provincial obverse dies remaining to be found. (If the 99 does not include your five crossover dies, then 34 left to be found.) Having said that, The Royal Mint had 31 obverse dies left over at the end of 1859, so these may have been destroyed without ever striking a coin. If so, we may down to having to finding 8 obverse dies.

Reverses are a different matter. There are currently 62 known 1858 reverse dies and 15 known W9/8 dies. Jim has 221 narrow 9 reverse dies. The Mint sank 402 reverse dies. That leaves 104 unknown. At the end of 1859 the Mint had 42 reverse dies left over. If they were unused, then we are looking for 62 reverses. I suspect almost all of those are narrow 9 reverses.

My 77 reverses for 1858 and 1859 W9/8, make me hopeful that only one of those remains undiscovered. The Royal Mint sank seven batches, totaling 78 reverse dies up through November 3, 1858. If they sank only 1858 reverses in those seven batches, then that leaves one. Or thirteen if the next batch was 1858 also. Who really knows for sure? This hobby stopped surprising me a while ago.

Cheers,
Rob
http://www.victoriancent.com

2011 & 2025 Fred Bowman Award Winner, 2020 J. Douglas Ferguson Award Winner, & 2022 Paul Fiocca Award Winner. Life Member of RCNA.
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Phil310's Avatar
United States
1101 Posts
 Posted 10/26/2019  11:23 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Phil310 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The 99 obverse die count DOES include the 5 crossover bridge dies.

I wonder too how many dies are left to be found. It's been over two years since a new N9 die has been found. Any new ones would have to be pretty scarce I expect, but I am sure there are some more waiting to be discovered.

To me it's a lot of fun searching for pieces of this provincial cent puzzle. The picture gets a little more complete with every new die that's found.

One thing that would surprise me would be to find a 1858-1859 N9 bridge die but I'm going to look just the same because you never know.
Edited by Phil310
10/26/2019 1:11 pm
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fourmack's Avatar
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1679 Posts
 Posted 10/27/2019  2:18 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add fourmack to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Yay- this does not surprise me as there must be a lot more to find.
(go look in Bills lot as this is where this came from)
I know this is number 3 because of the triple G

Quote:
I just noticed that your obverse has the radial die crack at the R of GRATIA. Usually you do not see that on coins paired with the narrow 9 reverse, so your coin must have been one of the last ones minted before they changed to the RD13 wide 9 reverse die.


More-1859-Obverse-Bridge-Dies
More-1859-Obverse-Bridge-Dies
More-1859-Obverse-Bridge-Dies
Cheers Don

Vickies cents and GB Farthings nut.
"Old" is a figure of speech and nothing more
Edited by fourmack
10/27/2019 2:24 pm
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Phil310's Avatar
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1101 Posts
 Posted 10/27/2019  4:17 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Phil310 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Don, your bridge die (Haxby 1a / Turner OG3) is the only one of the 5 known bridge dies that was paired with a N9 reverse die first. The other 4 were paired with W9/8 first.

Another interesting thing about this bridge die is that it shared a narrow 9 reverse (E2) with one of the new bridge dies (Haxby 1 / Turner OG2). This ties together a group of W9/8 and N9 1859 reverse dies. This can get complicated and boring for those not into die studies, but is fascinating and helpful for those of us who are.
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